WhoKnows

I would suggest checking now and then not looking again until week 1 next year.

But they look like they may have found a QB and all of a sudden they are in games against the Rams and beat up the Bears who throttled us 36-10. Having a QB that can win you games makes a huge difference than a QB who’s being protected from making multiple red zone interceptions like Daniel Jones.

I agree. Take the Giants, for example. There was a thread about how our 3 rookie WRs/TEs had more yards than Nabers, but they have Nabers, Wandale and Johnson as three 23 (Coker is 23) and under receivers that I would take over ours, mainly because Nabers is a stud. Heck, Jones is absolutely the reason why we beat the Giants. A good QB and we lose easily. We’ve got some decent young guys, but we are missing a lot and let’s be honest our young guys can be good, but I am not sure I see above average yet, which is top 10 or 12 in the NFL.

That’s not real tanking to ask the team and coaches to lose on purpose. Honestly, I don’t think you really can do that. Remember Doug Pederson getting fired? That was so ridiculously obvious that he put a trash QB in to lose on purpose to improve their draft pick. I don’t think I’ve ever seen it outside of that one game and it got the coach fired and that wasn’t players not trying. That was putting in a QB who had no business ever playing. You see real tanking in the NBA and MLB every year, although the NFL’s trade deadline is getting more active lately.

Well, the “best” case scenario IMHO for the 2021 draft is pick 3 and trade it to the 49ers. I would have taken Parsons or Slater with the 2021 first (12). No idea who I would have taken in 2022 (Cole Strange was the pick) and 2023 (maybe Kincaid or Flowers). That would have been a nice haul if we had 1 more loss because the SOS would have moved us from 8 to 3.

No and that’s part of the silliness in these discussions. Tanking has zero to do with coaches/players. Tanking has everything to do with the GM/front office. Here’s how I would have tanked in 2022: 1. Let Rhule tank the season with his greatness. 2. Trade CMC to SF. 3. Trade Burns to the Rams for that ridiculous haul. 4. Trade Moore to Packers for their 1st. 5. Trade whoever else we could that has value as a good vet and probably isn’t even on the team in 2025+. I tank by trading away the big time talent and piling up picks and cap space. I do this because I supposedly want to draft a QB high so I want my 2023 pick to be as high as possible.

Horn is not an all pro, people in here overrate our players. He’s good to very good when he plays but until he actually gets named an all pro, he isn’t one like Sewell and Chase have been multiple times. We’d have a better team overall with either of these two. Sewell would be a LT for us, he was all through college and switched over for Decker. Yes, there are always great players all over the draft, it happens. My point was that we could be a vastly more talented team if we just lost one more game in 2019/2020. I probably should have put 2023 since I was referring to the draft dates in the other two but I was focusing more on the end of the year run than the 2023 draft I couldn’t really peg where we would have ended up. Too many variables.

See my post above. We tankers get all the you aren’t a fan of you want to get a higher draft pick but damn we’ve given up generational talent because of some meaningless wins coupled with even worse drafting/trading of picks. The “real” fans can’t seem to get that we are two wins in 2019/2020 away from having Herbert throwing to Chase every week and still having CMC and Moore along with the picks we wasted on Corral, Darnold and Young. We’d be a solid playoff team even with Rhule and Fitterer.

It is all about who picks the best but that’s a bit obvious. Also, below are a few examples right out of our own draft picks showing where having a better pick is very meaningful. There are plenty of idiots like Chicago, Cleveland and the Jets, who like us, take a Young over Stroud. That said, having the top pick did mean it was our choice. If we picked Stroud, Houston was screwed for not moving up but we had a guy named Fo Anyway, here are the very recent Panther examples: 2020 - We had 1 too many wins so we got Derrick Brown 1 pick after Herbert. Brown is a solid player and I’m glad to have him, but let’s be honest that Herbert would have been much, much better and we would have skipped over the travesty of trading away CMC for nothing, giving away DJ Moore and trading the farm for Young. One draft slot away from an entirely different NFL team. 2021 - We had 1 too many wins so we got Horn instead of all pro tackle Sewell, all pro WR Chase or choosing to trade pick 3 (one less win and we got there) to SF for 3 firsts and I think 1 third. Horn is a good CB, but our team would have been much better with Chase, Sewell or all the 1sts. 2022 - Great end of the year run due to an easy schedule and not tanking for a QB by trading Burns to the Rams, Moore to the Packers and others. We all know what happened here and damn would it have been nice to have say Arizona’s pick and watch Houston choose Young!

Wow, if you combine 3 starters for our team they finally outgain Nabers, who’s missed 2 games as well? I’m happy the rookies don’t appear to be just plain bad like we’ve seen the last few years, but they aren’t close to Nabers. The Giants have a terrible offense and QB but if you look at their 23 year old and younger WRs/TE, Nabers, Robinson and Johnson have 1239 yards. Our 3 aren’t as good as the Giants young 3 or at least aren’t yet and likely won’t be because Nabers will be a stud when they dump Jones. I’d trade all 3 of our guys for Nabers and draft another WR and TE.

Well you can always rely on multiple red zone interceptions every week. Young has been better the past two weeks but the best record of our opponents in our three wins is 3-7. Those were the games we circled in preseason as our best chances to win a game. We’ll see what happens on Sunday.

Lol. I’ve enjoyed watching both wins with my youngest. Hubbard’s been awesome. That said, we’ve beaten 2-8, 3-7 (1 win against us) and 2-7 teams. You can imagine all you want what this team would be like without injuries but every team has injuries. We aren’t a good team and I don’t begrudge any fans looking to the draft pick either. I enjoyed every win but I also know that even with some healthy guys, this is not a playoff team. This is a team that playing mistake free can beat other 2-3 win bottom 5-10 teams. I hope we get a great pick that someone else desperately wants or lands us a legit D stud. I’m not a QB fan this year but maybe someone else is. I don’t see many wins, if any, left.

It doesn’t? Washington traded away Sweat and Young in 2023 and landed pick 2 in 2024. They also let Howell get 25 turnovers on the way to 4 wins. They took Daniels with pick 2 and are looking like a playoff team. It’s not hard to find examples of tanking working. When you take a Young over a Stroud, don’t trade Burns early and you don’t tank, it can hurt way worse than just tanking because if you make a QB drafting mistake, you’ve got no extra picks to recover.

Exactly. He assumed the play was over and was jogging back in and then couldn’t make the tackle. WTF, man, should have been a couple yard gain.

Yeah, have fun with that.

Reminds me of when Fitt punked the Saints by taking Marshall one pick before them or when Hurney stole Grier from the Patriots when Maxx Crosby was on the board and was one of our private visits. We draft scared and worried about other teams instead of just drafting well with what your given.

Worst part about the pick is that the 2025 RB class is way the fug better. Only 3 RBs were rated as 2nd/3rd rounders including Brooks, and none had a first round grade. This year there looks to be 10 RBs with up to 2nd/3rd round grades and a couple with first round grades. It’s very likely that some of the 2025 RBs in round 3 are as good as Brooks and they aren’t coming off ACLs so we’d have them at a rookie deal for 4 years instead of just the 3 years we’ll have Brooks due to the injury. If we ever get a GM with brains, we would have had a future anchor at C with the 2nd round pick last draft and our Chuba helper with an early 3rd or 4th in 2025 and had better overall draft value. Fitterer (and Hurney) were the same as Morgan and liked to pick positions that were weak in the draft. That's like thinking Pickett was a better QB option than Josh Allen or Lamar Jackson because he was the 1st QB taken in the 1st round. One day we’ll have a GM that realizes drafts are weak/strong at different positions and it can change every year.

Probably.

50%? How about almost 100%? Iky was picked 6th overall. Sewell went 7th the year before. A tackle taken 6th should be a stud. We had 9 complete wastes, 2 backup level players and one maybe average starter and that was with pick 1, pick 6 and pick 1 in 2024. That’s likely the two worst drafts any GM has ever had back to back. You can point to some Hurney drafts but at least he still had Cam or Luke at the tops of terrible drafts. Even Matt Millen followed up Charles Rogers with Calvin Johnson. Fitt didn’t even get a really good player even with top or the draft picks.

Morgan played with Delhomme too and Jake couldn’t be much more different from Vick. Not sure what either of them would mean since Young sure wasn’t fast or as great at running as Vick and certainly didn’t have his arm. If Vick had any bearing, Morgan would have backed Tepper to take Fields and told Fitterer before he was officially hired a week after that draft. Heck, he could have traded for Fields from the Bears instead of trading for Young.

That’s interesting because he was one of the few people that we didn’t hear wanted Stroud. Reich and McCown we heard rumors about wanting Stroud, not Morgan. Pretty sure the articles pointed to Morgan being Fitt’s right hand man. I’m sure everyone wanted Stroud now but that’s not what we heard. Also, I don’t recall Morgan even being involved on the QB side. It’s not like he has the background to pick a proper QB anyway.

Not really. He was against the Burns to Rams trade. There have been articles by Panthers writers saying he was in lock step with Fitterer on most decisions. I think Tepper wanted a new face that he still knew well.

Just to temper this trade a bit, don’t forget how badly we missed on Mingo. If you look at the WRs taken after Mingo it’s depressing. There are 9 WRs taken after Mingo that have more yardage than he does including Nacua, Rashee Rice, Reed/Wicks in GB, Downs and Dell. There’s also some WRs that having gotten nearly the snap counts but are starting to come on like Tillman in Cleveland. SMH, some of those guys like Dell and Downs the draft forum was yelling to get instead.

They are so inconsistent. Chubba averaged 4.8 ypc and Moton gives up no pressures. How was Moton’s run blocking so bad that he scored lower than a guy who drops a perfectly thrown long TD?

Nice. Just happy to get something to help with this rebuild. The Diontae trade probably didn’t even change who we will pick in the late 5 (probably would be there early 6th).