Bear Hands

11 hours ago, jfra78 said:

Just watch us not draft a NT

There is usually one annual glaring perceived need that we ignore for the most part. But I think the defense’s performance was poor enough to warrant a pretty major overhaul sans Brown & Horn.

Trevin should hopefully stick and Jewell+Wonnum should still be here, but the rest is pretty much up in the air. Futures of Tuttle, Robinson, Woods, Jackson, & Shaq are unsure even considering some contracts.

Seems like a decent IDL FA and draft to add from.

Just now, Davidson Deac II said:

The Lions are starting to get a little healthier.  They still have some significant people out, but they also get a few back.  

Yeah they'll be tough to beat.  I'm excited to see the WAS matchup.  Detroit has the defensive personnel to make Daniels frustrated, even if they aren't consistently getting pressure.  I really wish they had Hutch back, he would be so much fun to watch in the playoffs against a QB like Daniels.

9 hours ago, Bear Hands said:

The Eagles are a confusing team for me.  Barkley has been awesome, but Moore's offense tends to go through some self-inflicted lulls.  Very beatable.

The Lions are a bit injury bitten.  

The Commanders & the winner of tonight have decent shots.

Now being mostly healthy, the Rams may be the ones positioned for a run.  

If I'm going off purely momentum right now, Rams - Ravens could be an interesting SB that not many saw coming.  

 

Feeling a bit confident in this assessment right meow

I'm a bit iffy on Mykel.  He has a high ceiling but I thought he miss-timed a lot of snaps, didn't have the best awareness with reading plays, and isn't a closer.  I may be alone here, but I have him as a late R1 at best.  He'll test well, but he needs time to develop.

38 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Walker is one of my guys after the first round. He and Harold Fanin Jr. I think are going to be very good from that non-first round group.

Yeah he's a dude.  Everything I've read on him sounds like he's ready to make noise in the league too.  Seems like a real grinder.  Team captain too.  

10 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

A dare say a RB coming off an ACL injury is at higher risk than a LB to re-injure the knee due to cutting, shifting, stutter stepping etc...  That bore itself out.  I get the shoulder surgeries with Wilson, but he was/is healthy and had dropped to the point where the risk was worth the selection.  If he had a clean medical, Wilson would have been a late first rounder.

If your beef is about us taking Brooks over him, then I can get that.  I'm explaining why teams were likely hesitant with him.  Great talent.  

1 minute ago, thunderraiden said:

This is dumb, these are all the positions that were backloaded in the draft and would have been R1-2 talent in most drafts. This is why you see some of us this year going draft Tet or trade back and get an edge because the position is loaded at edge this year, yeah we need an edge but outside of Carter they are all the same and a decent Round 1 edge in this draft can be found in R2 much like CB was last year.

Not speaking positionally.  Every position group is represented in the list. 

And I'd say their value aligned much better with their selections and this current class is a bit thin overall.  Some decent edge rushers, sure, but I think Carter would have been ED3 or 4 last year.  I'd love to hear a good argument for him vs. Verse, Turner, or Latu as prospects.  I feel he's quite behind them from the standpoint of awareness, run defense, and actual pass rush moveset and technique.  His upper body technique is really spotty.  He's better than his predecessor in Chop, I'll give you that.   

This draft has maybe 12-15 R1 grades IMO.  

1 minute ago, 45catfan said:

I've barked up that tree regarding Brooks and Wilson.  It's hypocritical to take guys off your board/severely downgraded them due to past injuries (currently healthy) only to draft another player who was actively rehabbing from injury. Our front office is so damn incompetent.

I like Morgan, but dude HAS TO do better this time around or he can go hang out with his buddy Scott Fitterer.

I'd argue Wilson's risk is inherently different given he had a reconstruction & revision on his knee, he also had surgery on both shoulders and was an older prospect at 24.  Teams were hesitant, and at their own detriment, because he's balling out.  And he was still a top-100 guy so it's not like some Trey Smith type fall.  

The size thing doesn't get to me.  I feel many still are looking through the 3-down 4-3 lens.

This basically IS the prototypical modern EDGE size minus the outliers who can play all schemes and are 6'4+, 260+.  Miller, Parsons & Mack examples aside, just look at the younger blooming guys right now:

Anderson Jr. 6'4 243, Bonitto 6'3 240, Tuli is 6'3 265, Byron Young 6'2 250, Highsmith 6'4 242, Huff 6'3 255, Verse is 6'4 260, Herbig 6'2 240....

Even TJ Watt's playing weight is in the 250s.  It's about playing strength.  Taking from that list above- PIT has 3 main rotation pieces at the edge that are 255, 242, & 240.   

That being said, I'm still really lukewarm about this kid.  

13 minutes ago, jfra78 said:

No mention of Peyton Wilson

Solely to anger the Wolfpack contingent lol

Responding to some -

I'd say it's less about classifying a player as a boom/bust and more understanding the level at which rookies are thought of and trusted by organizations around the league.  These are the best teams in the league and they're putting decent trust in the big moments with less experienced guys, whether due to an injury or genuinely earning their playing time.  

We've had a tendency to look a bit longer term with a lot of picks in hopes the upside can be hit.  Which is fine I guess, but our track record is getting really bad so maybe we should stop lol. 

Thing is, you have a guy that fell who could be a great boost (Ladd, Newton, DeJean, Lassiter, etc.) and we stick with the guy we love and have a bit of tunnel-vision for.  It seems to be a trend here...getting too locked in on "our guy" and not seeing how the chips fall.  I often wonder if the Fit/Morgan era years would have taken Star when he fell to us in his draft.  

The funny thing with this last draft is that I feel like we struck a good pick with Trevin & Sanders.  But XL and Brooks really did feel forced.  Morgan was predetermined to get both by whatever means. 

My hope for 2025: we fall in love a bit less with prospects and are able to assess in-the-moment a bit better.  

The Eagles are a confusing team for me.  Barkley has been awesome, but Moore's offense tends to go through some self-inflicted lulls.  Very beatable.

The Lions are a bit injury bitten.  

The Commanders & the winner of tonight have decent shots.

Now being mostly healthy, the Rams may be the ones positioned for a run.  

If I'm going off purely momentum right now, Rams - Ravens could be an interesting SB that not many saw coming.  

Considering our needs and our R2-3 draft history, I think you gotta call about Wilson. He would be a prized get, a tier above the other potential trade targets.  See what the deal is and what we could swing.  Why tf not. 

Regarding those other targets, with our FO's obsession with a certain type, it wouldn't surprise me if we call SEA about Metcalf.  Maybe send a feeler out for Deebo too.   Elsewhere, I think Michael Pittman could be a very interesting guy to call about.  He shines any time there's consistent QB play (which has been few and far between in IND)

FA wise, Higgins will obviously be a target, but I just don't see us being the winning bid.  Godwin, I'd actually like to see us pursue.  Outside of that, I don't see anyone jumping out that would want me to push aside Coker & XL's playing time for.  Some of the other proven vets are kind of past the cliff and the young talent is very mid.  Would rather draft competition.  

The short version: We need to draft better

The long: "You can't expect day 2 or 3 guys to make an impact".  Well, beyond the 1st rounders (Daniels, Quinyon, Barton, etc.), these are dudes with significant playing time or starters in the playoffs for solid squads.  I'm probably not even hitting them all.  

This tells me you absolutely can and should target impact guys in R2-3 at a variety of spots.  We absolutely need to break this round 2-3 torment we put ourselves in.  

Just check this out..post-R1 rookies WITH SIGNIFICANT PLAYING TIME this weekend:

Keon Coleman WR - BUF R2

Ladd McConkey WR - LAC R2

Johnny Newton DL - WAS R2

Mike Sainristil DB - WAS R2

Cooper DeJean DB - PHI - R2

Braden Fiske DL - LAR - R2

Kamari Lassiter DB - HOU - R2

Zach Frazier C - PIT - R2

Blake Fisher OT - HOU - R2

Edgerin Cooper LB - GB R2

Javon Bullard DB - GB - R2

Jalen McMillan WR - TB R3

Jalyx Hunt DE - PHI R3

Kamren Kitchens DB - LAR R3

Calen Bullock DB - HOU R3

Troy Franklin WR - DEN R4

Beaux Limmer C - LAR R6

Love to see it for Chinn & Luvu

Just now, kungfoodude said:

I believe he may be watching the replay on NFL Network.

lol that's hilarious

15 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Nix and Penix both have shown way more arm talent on their rookie seasons than I thought they had based on their college play.

Seems like the Bills might have come into this one a little too cocky. We'll see how they respond to an early punch in the nose.

Nix took some time to get comfortable, and has had the benefit of a good system, but he's grown so much.  The confidence and decision making has been great.  

I've seen people rag on him due to benefiting to environment and being a glorified manager, but he's by all means looked great this year.  

Flowers out is pretty big.

For the one about to start - I gotta think Stingley and Lassiter against McConkey and QJ are the matchups that is a big factor in deciding the outcome.  

3 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

I think the Chargers win easily and Pittsburgh wins. Betting on the Lamar curse continuing. 

That would put KC against PIT and then BUF against LAC.  Interesting matchups, although I think LAC is the team KC doesn't want to see next week.  Never bet against Mahomes, but that matchup could be difficult for them.  KC's DL would have a hard time getting any pressure on Herbert.  

My weekend guesses:

LAC over HOU - Chargers have some big momentum

BAL over PIT - Lamar is playoff shaky, but they get it done.  Russ has a dud

BUF over DEN - Allen takes care of business, but this may start closer than expected.  

TB over WAS - High scoring, Baker beats the rook.

LAR over MIN - Rams are healthy and reset for the playoffs.  I think they're going to be a problem.

GB over PHI - I think GB's defense could be a lot for a cold Hurts coming off his concussion.  

-

Rams/Lions NFCC, Chiefs/Bills AFCC

Allen finally beats Mahomes.  Detroit's injuries catch up to them.  

BUF-LAR SB, Bills take it

47 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Honestly, I don't think so but it only takes one to tango.

We may be bad with contracts at times, but so are quite a few other teams haha

1 hour ago, Martin said:

There seem to be an unusual number of good 4-3 DEs in this draft. Not sure if Sawyer fits in a 3-4 or not. But I love him as a football player, he’s the type of player you want on your team. 

I think there's more than a few EDGEs that can play 5-tech which is what I'd like to think we target as our base is only deployed so much of the time.  You need the types that can stand or go hands-in-the-dirt package dependent. 

A lot of drafts are more packed with the speedy athletic ones, but I'm seeing guys like Sawyer, his teammate JT (who I find possibly even more intriguing), Gillote, Ivey, Ezeiruaku, Swinson ain't too bad either.  All with solid power & athleticism to their games.  

There's some that are the high upside sub-package only types like Princely, Pearce, etc. but it's a deeper crew that offers a wide range of talent.  Not a fan of the top, but I would be miffed if we don't land one in Round 2-4.  

4 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I like Gillote. Isn't he going to be at the Senior Bowl?

Yeah I believe so.

I like a few things about his game:

-Great run defender, good awareness to break off engagement and quickly move laterally.  His twitch and quickness is legit.

-Moveset: has a nice swim, power rush (against guards and tackles).  Good bend but he just thrives in the trenches. His power seems to be a top strength which I like for us.

-Good size and provides versatility.  He's 6'3 275, and a quick dude.  Evero tends to flex in guys like Clowney in nickel packages which we could do with someone like Gillote.  

-Combining the high motor, strength, size, quickness, he easily has 3-down ability. 

Overall, he's the type that will get a us pushing OLs backwards quicker.  Need that type of EDGE who isn't afraid to go at it in the trenches. 

Jack Sawyer, Donovan Ez, Ashton Gillotte, & Mike Green are names to know.

Sawyer had himself a game.

1 hour ago, mav1234 said:

Yup we could use a couple of options that could work on short routes / screens for YAC. Screens to AT and XL need to never happen again, lol

Ricky White is one to look at IMO. Could fit well for what we need.