tukafan21

Trading Burns = Rebuilding the right way.... I will give you that point, however................. We just traded Burns on HIS terms, to get HIM the best contract, not on OUR terms to get US the best return Which flips that from rebuilding the right way to continuing to cut off our nose to spite our face, yet again, because they keep trying for the quick fix, not the right fix.

Just made this post in another thread where someone asked if I was going to stop being a fan, then saw this thread and realized I needed to re-post it in here, so this is just a straight copy/paste of my other post........ There are levels of rooting though No, I don't love the Panthers any less. No, I'm not considering stopping being a fan. But for a long time, my favorite teams went as follows, with the number of dots approximating the gap of fandom between each, from "live and die with every game" for Arizona Basketball to "barely remember to check the scores" for the rest of them (like the Red Wings or Tigers). And to be clear, loving a team and fandom of them is different to me. Love is how deeply they're ingrained into your heart and soul, whereas fandom is how much you care/think about them on a daily basis. Arizona Basketball.. Panthers.................. Every other team I root for In the past 18ish months (basically starting with the CMC trade), it's now shifted to the following Arizona Basketball.. Wrexham AFC................................................. Panthers............. Every other team I root for (yes, I got sucked into Welcome to Wrexham and am now a die hard Wrexham fan for life) We've traded away draft picks and the 3 best players we've had since the Cam era for Bryce and a bag of loose change. We can't hire the right coaches, we can't sign the right players, we can't draft the right players, we literally haven't made one good move in this time frame. I literally never thought I'd feel this way about the Panthers, they were one of 2 teams that were never going to have to win back my interest. But I can't defend them anymore, it's been that bad. So again, no I'm not going anywhere as a fan, but right now, I just don't really care much for them in the slightest, they don't register for me on the daily anymore, they're just a thing that I have slight interest in and they have to earn my level of fandom back.

There are levels of rooting though No, I don't love the Panthers any less. No, I'm not considering stopping being a fan. But for a long time, my favorite teams went as follows, with the number of dots approximating the gap of fandom between each, from "live and die with every game" for Arizona Basketball to "barely remember to check the scores" for the rest of them (like the Red Wings or Tigers). And to be clear, loving a team and fandom of them is different to me. Love is how deeply they're ingrained into your heart and soul, whereas fandom is how much you care/think about them on a daily basis. Arizona Basketball.. Panthers.................. Every other team I root for In the past 18ish months (basically starting with the CMC trade), it's now shifted to the following Arizona Basketball.. Wrexham AFC................................................. Panthers............. Every other team I root for (yes, I got sucked into Welcome to Wrexham and am now a die hard Wrexham fan for life) We've traded away draft picks and the 3 best players we've had since the Cam era for Bryce and a bag of loose change. We can't hire the right coaches, we can't sign the right players, we can't draft the right players, we literally haven't made one good move in this time frame. I literally never thought I'd feel this way about the Panthers, they were one of 2 teams that were never going to have to win back my interest. But I can't defend them anymore, it's been that bad. So again, no I'm not going anywhere as a fan, but right now, I just don't really care much for them in the slightest, they don't register for me on the daily anymore, they're just a thing that I have slight interest in and they have to earn my level of fandom back.

No I gave them the benefit of doubt when they took Bryce despite it being glaringly obvious that he just doesn't have the physical traits needed to be an elite NFL QB. I gave them that benefit of doubt that during the draft process, they saw such a beyond next level mental side of the game that it would more than overcome any physical limitations he had. While I get he was a rookie on a terrible team last year, his mental side of the game wasn't even average for a rookie QB, let alone the #1 pick who was supposed to have one of the greatest football minds the draft has ever seen. And all of that is before he somehow looked even worse physically than expected, and I was already expecting him to look like the worst QB in the league from a physical standpoint, he looked like he didn't even belong as a backup in this league.

Yep, you’re probably right here, which…………. leads to the other thread I just made, go check it out we fuged up

The Bengals

Is because Morgan and Tepper have no balls, let me explain............ Burns was never going to play a single snap on the franchise tag this season, he showed his hand when he admitted he played scared this season out of concern of injury without his contract. We let him dictate the terms of a trade by doing it today, it allowed him to demand more money from whatever team traded for him, thus allowing that team to have a reason to be stingy on the compensation coming back out way. We should have let Burns sweat, let him sit there for a few weeks and when he realized he wasn't getting this $30 million a year contract and knew he wasn't going to play a snap on the tag, he'd have been willing to sign a cheaper contract (in the $25M a year range) as it would have been that or sitting out the season. I guarantee that teams would have given better compensation if they were able to get him on a cheaper deal like that, 100% chance a team more in contention would have given us a late 1st rounder for him on a deal like that. This was Morgan and Tepper not having the balls the play this one out and force Burns to show his hand, which was that he was NEVER going to sign the tag and play on it, I'll never be convinced otherwise.

Just like nobody was going to pay him $30 million a year? That contract alone says we should have got a 1st for him To me, this more screams this front office is trying to look for the quick fix and they were only going to trade Burns for an asset in this year's draft, but trading him for a 1st next season would have been the smart move as we're not 1 offseason away from fixing this franchise, it's a multi year thing.

This is a joke, right? That would only compound the issue as we have a serious lacking of quality players. The only way using this extra 2nd to move up in the draft to get into the 1st for a WR is to use BOTH of those 2nds, or if we're lucky, give up this 2nd and our 3rd to maybe get the 30th pick. We need multiple starters with these picks, not package them together to get 1 starter.

This actually hurts our ability to get a #1 WR as the only path to it this year was through a Burns trade We didn't get enough back to flip for a #1 WR This was HORRIBLE

The point isn't that he's worth that much money, it's that if someone was willing to apy him that much, then we should have been getting more in return for him We got fleeced, period, no way around it, 3rd time in 2 years.

The only difference it makes is the level of awfulness that this trade is If it's their earlier pick, then it's really really really bad, if it's their later pick, then it's really really really really bad

Yes it is The contract the Giants are giving him is all the proof you need that we didn't get enough for him Anyone worth a $30 million a year contract should never be traded for less than a 1st, let alone a 2nd and a future 5th

Honestly, just the fact that they gave him a contract worth $30 a year is proof that he shouldn't have been traded for less than a 1st, let alone a 2nd and a future 5th We just got fleeced on a 3rd trade in the past 2 years, unbelievable

2nd and a 5th?!?!?!?!?! fug this franchise, what a joke, fire Morgan immediately

There are probably only a dozen non QB's in the entire NFL that a team would give up the 6th pick in the draft for when they know they then have to give that player a $25+ million contract to And spoiler alert, Burns sure as poo aint one of those players.

lol of course 6 is off the table If 6 was on the table we would probably throw in cash to pay part of Burns' salary

There literally isn't a position we're set at We have one elite player on the entire roster in Brown, but after that, there honestly isn't a player locked into a single starting spot as of this moment outside of Thielen, Bryce, and Horn. One of whom is likely already a bust that we're forced to start, another hasn't been able to stay healthy, and Thielen is a slot WR who has maybe 1 or 2 years left in his career. Even Moton isn't locked in as they could decide to cut their losses due to the cap hit if they can't re-work a deal. Ickey isn't locked in at LT as they could end up moving him to LG. And on defense, outside of Burns and Horn, I'm not sure we even have any average starters, so nobody is locked in to any spot yet.

Yes, sorry, I didn't mean they had a full agreement already ironed out and in place, but they 100% already had a high level discussion and agreement on relative compensation. There would be no point in the teams working out a deal, only to find out the Giants and Burns were too far apart to come to a deal. It would literally waste everyone's time, the Panthers, the Giants, and Burns, so it just would never have gotten to this point unless the Giants and Burns were at least in the same ballpark. While at the same time, the Panthers and Giants also had to be in the same ball park of compensation for it to get to this point. None of that is to say it can't fall apart in the end, it's just saying that the threat of Burns blowing the deal up by refusing to sign his franchise tender so they can complete the trade, is a complete non-starter, as they're too far into the process for that to even be a concern to any party.

This is all completely moot There is a 0% chance that either the Giants or Panthers are discussing any deal, let alone deep into negotiations, if the Giants and Burns haven't talked and come to a general agreement on a contract extension, as it would be a complete waste of everyone's time if that wasn't already done.

Yea, I saw your post and chose to ignore it because it was stupid I never once said we shouldn't be spending money, I've said time and time again that we need to spend it wisely. No, I don't love paying that much for a guard, but he fits the mold of who I said we should be spending on, someone young enough that can be a good player for not only this contract, but still young enough to sign another with us when this one is done. I was against throwing enough money at Ridley to come here instead of going to a contender, as his age at his position doesn't make him likely to be even elite for the length of a 3-4 year contract, let alone sign another after.

I think you are joking here, but that wouldn't be a nightmare scenario, it would be the final nail in the coffin of this franchise. It would mean firing a coach for the 3rd straight year, to hire a guy who is NOT an NFL coach, his style won't work with NFL players, it only can work with college kids. And then you'd be drafting his son and thus locking yourself into a situation for 3 years where you can't fire the coach no matter how bad it goes because it would then basically make your QB refuse to play for you if you did. That's all also before even taking into consideration that Sanders is nowhere near as good as the hype around him is, if he was as good as the hype, Colorado wouldn't have been as bad as they were this year

In what world? If we don't get a 1st plus more for Burns, then we're making a bad trade, period. I know the fans here don't think he's worth it, but the NFL does, and that's all that matters, the teams in the league view Burns in an absurdly better light than 99.99% of the fans here. And the Bengals 100% would take a 1st in exchange for Higgins who has asked to be traded, it doesn't sound like he has any interest in playing on the tag there there year.

Really what we should be looking for is their 1st next season and their second 2nd rounder from this year. Then try to flip the 1st for Higgins

Do we even have a 2nd best defensive player now after Brown? Honestly, who is the 2nd best player on this defense if you remove both Burns and Luvu? Probably Horn in reality, but given his injury history, not sure if you can consider him that, really don't know who would be next in line.