tukafan21

No, no we shouldn't have drafted Fields. I'm also still very much of the opinion that the Bears should have traded Fields instead of the draft pick. He's a great running QB, but he's a worse passer than Lamar or Cam. Teams eventually figure out how to defend those running QB's, especially as they get older and bodies start to breakdown a little bit and are forced to run less and pass from the pocket more. Fields is never going to be an elite QB, taking a possible shut down corner was WAY smarter. The only debate is if we should have taken Surtain over Horn, but I'm still good with Horn.

Those last 2 bullet points are about as scary as possible. In what world should an assistant coach have more sway in the room than the HC? And just because the moron you hired before Reich was a bubbling bafoon, it doesn't mean you should step in as a non football person to make the football decision. You hired Reich, you let him and your GM make the decision together. You allow everyone else to provide their input and say for them to consider, but you just hired Reich to be the guy, you have to let him choose the QB or else why did you hire him? If Reich wanted to take Levis over Young, okay, maybe then I'm stepping in as the owner and putting my foot down (at least after giving up what we did to move up to #1). But not if they're debating between the two players that are almost universally viewed as the 1-2 at the top.

This place would also are unbearable if we take Stroud and then Young goes on to be the best short QB of all time, plays a long 15 year career, and Stroud is anything less than a HOF in his own right. I'm in the Stroud camp myself, but the point is that you can do it both ways with these guys. They're forever going to be linked by Panthers and Texans fan bases no matter who chooses who, because both sides will always have to play the "what if game" with the player they don't select. To be honest though, it's why I was never a fan of trading a haul to move up in the draft this year. I don't think either are can't miss prospects and by moving up to #1, it really puts that pressure and hindsight on everyone involved to have made the right call, and if not, it could haunt the franchise and fan base for decades, if not forever (think Trailblazer fans are over passing on Jordan yet? or how about Chargers fans wishing the Colts took Leaf instead?). Yea, I'm happy that we'll end up with one of the top 2 guys, but initially I wanted to either see if one of the 4 fell to us, only move up as high needed to ensure we landed the 4th off the board and save on some assets, or pass on QB completely this year and go all in to move up next year in a deeper class.

So...... basically the least shocking news of all time? If the staff didn't have dinner/meet with each of the Top 4 QB's, then they're not doing their jobs, even if they know with 100% certainty that they're taking Stroud or Young, you still have to do your due diligence. I don't see it happening, but what happens if they go through the process, decide they can't live with one of them for some reason, and then the other has a Laremy Tunsil situation on draft day, you need to have done your work on the other 2 just to be safe and certain.

I think Seattle is trying to trade back to pick up assets, can't think of any other reason for them to be doing this. Unless both the Panthers and Texans find something in one of these two guys that they can't live with, neither is trading out of the top 2 and neither are taking AR or Levis. So I take this as Seattle trying to make it look like they're interested in taking a QB at #5 if one falls to them in the hopes that someone gives them a sweetheart offer to move into the spot for that final top 4 QB.

And Stroud has a better arm and is probably a tad bit more accurate. There are things each are better at than the others, that's why there is no general consensus among talent evaluators as to who is actually the better prospect. Which is why I think they're very similarly rated prospects and you can nitpick which attributes you prefer in each of them. You can teach a QB to process and manage the game better, which by the way, Stroud isn't poor at those things, he's actually very good at them, he's just not quite the same level as Young there yet. But you can't teach Young to get bigger

I think that's exactly why this fan base is concerned over Young's size. If Cam broke down in the manner he did, why do we want to draft someone 7" and 50 lbs smaller and hope he'll hold up for 10+ years? I don't think a single person has ever argued that Stroud is going to stay healthier because of his size, it's the other way around, it's just the concern over Young not being able to because of his size. Those are two VERY different arguments

Not even in the slightest I'm justifying not picking a player because I don't think his frame is going to hold up. The whole water argument is solely about why I don't believe he actually weighs 205. Stroud weighed 10 lbs heavier at the combine than Young, in no way is that legitimate, like, zero, zilch, nada, absolutely not a chance in hell. So unless the scale was broken for one of them, Young was carrying a solid 10-15 lbs of additional weight that he doesn't play at or Stroud cut 10-15 lbs that he does play at... which one seems more likely to you?

Not really Doing it constantly for years on end it would take a serious toll, but not a one time thing.

You guys are also ignoring that he didn't work out at the combine either, I'll bet he ate terribly for the week leading into it on purpose knowing he didn't need to work out at the same time. You can easily put on 5+ lbs in a week with terrible eating on it's own, combine that with a lot of water in the 24 hours before weighing in and it's not hard to put on 15 lbs for that weigh in and then cutting it back to your normal weight within a few days afterwards.

you do realize how those fighters put that weight back on after cutting it, right? They don't go out there and eat a ton of food, they drink a poo ton of water and other performance related drinks. If they can put 15 lbs back on there without dying from water poisoning, it 100% works the other way around to put that water into your system for a few hours and then pee/sweat it all back out over the next day or so. And yes, there are safety issues to it, but not really from a one time thing like this is, it's that those guys do it constantly for their entire careers, that's why it's so bad for their bodies.

Absolutely, you don't think so? Every standard plastic water bottle is approximately 1 lbs of added weight. You don't think he could chug 10 of them in the 20 minutes before being weighed in, and that would be on top of him adding weight in the days leading into that day as well. Sure he'd feel bloated as hell and would piss like a racehorse afterwards, but that weighing in was the most important thing he can do to help his draft status, he would have been able to do it without any problem.

Yea... so I'll just say it since there really isn't a nice way to say it...... The whole, "can you tell me with certainty that CJ will last longer than Bryce" is by far, the dumbest, most moronic, asinine argument anyone can make, not to mention lazy. Let me ask you this... can you tell me with certainty that Bryce will be a better QB than CJ? If not, then you're still taking a chance (see how that works?) Again, nobody is saying his injury concern is the ultimate decision making factor, it's just all part of the equation that factors into your decision. If it was Young vs AR15 or Levis, then you take Young and take on that risk of his frame holding up. But when you have another prospect who is essentially already a toss up with Young in regards to actual football ability, the size factor is 100% something that can tip the scales in Stroud's favor.

I actually don't think Tepper will have any say in who we draft in the end. I think he's smart enough to realize he hired Reich and allowed him to put this staff together for a reason. He might give his own thoughts into the matter, but when it comes to actually making a decision, I think he's going to be smart enough to let the football guys make the actual call.

Name me a single QB of his frame that has had a successful NFL career? I'll help you out.... there hasn't been a single one Don't give me Wilson or Brees, they're significantly stockier built guys Don't give me Kyler as he also is stockier (particularly his lower body) and his game is more predicated on his running ability. Also jury is still very much out as to how is career is going to turn out, it was looking questionable last year before he got hurt as is. Again, as it's been stated ad nauseam, it's less about his height as much as it is about his frame, it's not built to last in the NFL at that position. If we draft him, we have to win a SB on his rookie contract as I don't see him making it through a second contract as an elite QB. And if that's the case, I'd much rather take someone who is only a marginally lesser prospect in Stroud, but is more likely to have a career twice as long.

Yea, and Cam took a ton of hits, both legal and illegal, in college and in the NFL, and his body still broke down in less than 10 years even though he was bigger than most of the defenders hitting him. It's not a matter of being concerned about Young breaking down in his first year or two, it's how is his body going to last after 5, 6, 7, 8, etc years in the league? He doesn't have a frame that is built to last, I'd rather have the guy who could play 12-15 years than the guy I can't see even making it to year 5 without missing significant chunks of time.

100% I don't think people understand how easy it would have been for him to add a lot of weight for that combine weigh in. He could have spent the 20 minutes before being weighed just chugging water non-stop and put on literally 10 lbs in just those 20 minutes before being weighed in. Lots of MMA fighters generally put on about 15-20 lbs in the 24 hours of being weighed in and stepping into the cage. That's not because they eat a ton of food and put weight back on, but because they starve their body of water leading into a weigh in and then put it back on just from fluids alone. The same thing can be done in reverse, which is absolutely what I think he did, there's no way he's 10 lbs lighter than Stroud like they weighed in at the combine, just looking at them you can see that's not the case.

If he was bigger, the Bears would have been trading Fields and would take Young themselves. His frame just can't be discounted when evaluating him, it's not the ultimate reasoning for anything or else he'd be a mid round pick, but when there is another prospect that is equally as good, but 5 inches taller and at least 20 lbs heavier (again, I don't believe Young's combine weight was anything other than a good 15 lbs of extra water weight), you gotta go with the QB more likely to hold up to the wear and tear of an NFL career.

When it comes to QB's, teams really should show up to pro days, talk to the player, watch him as he moves around the room and how he handles himself. And then just leave before the workout Those things are so scripted that it's near impossible for a QB to look bad, you're not going to learn anything new in watching them workout in that type of environment. But you absolutely can learn about who they are as a person and a leader by watching how they handle the room and that's really all you can learn about QB's at these things.

His mental game is the only reason I'd be accepting of him if we draft him over Stroud. Heard recently that a lot of times they would give him 2 plays to call in the huddle and then he would choose which play is run at the line of scrimmage. That's not normal in college, normally at that level the whole offense is looking at the sideline and they signal in which play is being run. I do love that about him. But I still go back to... it doesn't matter how smart he is or how well he can throw the ball, if he can't stay on the field it doesn't matter, and I very much struggle to see his frame holding up over a long NFL career.

I'll be honest, the only team on that list that makes any sense is the Ravens, odd list. Falcons are a worse team and will have a worse QB than we will Raiders and Bills have Adams and Diggs, not sure how either offense can really work and keep everyone happy with two WRs who need double digit targets every game to be happy, only one ball to be thrown around. And the Patriots OC is Bill O'Brien, can't see that working with Hopkins in the slightest.

I still say YGM and our 3rd or 4th should get it done. Don't even need to have Arizona eat any of the contract either, just sign him to a 2 year extension with the last year of it possibly just a voidable year, but really all it does is guarantee what is already on the contract and then it can be spread out over 4 years for cap purposes.

Wouldn't be for an extension, as the only one that would make sense is Burns, and extending him would lower his cap hit this year anyways, not raise it. Probably keeping it open for a WR trade if anything materializes, if not hold onto it to roll into next year when we already should have a lot of cap room and make a few splash signings. Also worth noting that we'll need to have the most cap room set aside for rookies given us having the #1 pick now.

I said right away when he didn't do any drills, the reason was because he likely was carrying a solid 10-15 lbs of water weight so he'd weigh in heavier, but it also would have screwed him up in the drills had he done them. Just look at him and you can see he's not 205, plays much lighter than that, he's just too small framed to hold up for a long NFL career.

There's also another way of looking at this The Texans already know they want Stroud and think the Panthers are taking him. So they don't send their main guys to the Pro Day, hoping the Panthers think they're sold on Young and that's who they want. So we swap picks with them thinking we're still going to get our guy and pick up more assets at the same time. Then the Texans take Stroud and played us like fools. That is exactly why I'm so against trading down, we have #1, you don't mess around, you take the guy you want and call it a day. And if we do swap, just for taking the risk and letting them get the guy they prefer, they have to pay through the nose