tukafan21

Hot Take.... Bryce is going to bring so much attention and money into the team that it's going to help land great players because they are going to want to join him. Oh... wait... this is a thread about Bryce Young for the Panthers... my bad ya'll, I'm still riding high on Bryce James committing to my Wildcats today. Guess @CamWhoaaCam is about to become a huge Arizona Basketball fan now too, we all know how much he loves son's of HOFers on Big 12 teams, LOL

If you think Bryce has the ability to fire the line drive rope throws that someone like Jameis or Wentz can throw, then I have some Arizona beachfront property to sell you. Bryce has to have a perfectly clean pocket to step into and make a perfect throw to get the ball 50 yards down the field, at least 20 other starting QB's in this league can make that throw off base and with just the flick of a wrist. If people want to believe Bryce can still be a good QB in this league, that's their prerogative, I'd disagree, but people can still think it. However, even those people have to understand and admit that he just doesn't have even an average starting QB arm for the NFL. Short of him starting to take steroids and bulk up like crazy, he'll always have one of the weakest arms of all starting QB's in the league, and that's not debatable.

I think if the Raiders can trade only their 2026 1st in addition to this year's first to get into position to get their QB, they'd do it in a heartbeat given all their QB issues over the years. Which is why I'd love to just be one pick ahead of them, so we still get whoever we would have taken without a trade back and pick up that extra 1st. But I don't think anyone is going to be dumb enough to give up a haul like we did for Bryce, it was too much then, it would be too much now. A single future 1st round pick though, that seems much more reasonable.

The alternative is you understand Bryce isn't the future AND that this team isn't a QB away from contending anyways. You trade Bryce for whatever the best offer is for him this offseason then go and sign someone like Jameis or Wentz this offseason to be the starter next year. Both are going to end up costing your team wins, it's they're not starters anymore, but they both have big arms and aren't afraid to sling the rock. It will help our young offensive weapons grow as they'll get tons of targets from all sorts of routes, but yes, they're likely to cause us to lose a lot of games, which is fine as it's a QB loaded draft next year, where we then draft a QB with our 1st rounder. Fans won't like it next year while we're losing, but the reality of the situation is that it's the fastest way to get us back on the right track towards having a contending team again. If we luck out and get the #1 pick and get Manning, then we could have a really bright future too.

No, still at 6th With a loss next week, the lowest we can be is 7th given the SOS's of the teams we're tied with, highest we can get to is 2nd. Even with a win the most we can fall is likely 9th as (not sure our SOS can rise enough to catch the Saints to fall to 10th) I think the best outcome for us is we lose along with wins by the Jets, Jags, Giants, and Titans (possible with the Jets getting Miami maybe without Tua and the others playing teams with nothing to play for). That puts us 3rd behind the Patriots and Browns with the Raiders behind us at #4. Then one of the two teams ahead of us fall in love with Hunter and take him, the other trades with the Giants to take a QB. We are then able to leverage the threat of a trade to someone like the Titans or Jets and get the Raiders to give us their 2026 1st (and maybe more) to swap picks with us so we can still take the player we want and add draft capital at the same time.

Dude, you were literally one of the people the last couple years talking about how winnable our division is because of the QB and HC situations for each team and that it should have made us an attractive option for the HC/QB candidates out there. Now because it doesn't fit your narrative (your love of Shedeur and him going to the Raiders), you're arguing that players shouldn't factor the division into their decision making. You can't have it both ways. And even then, this is just a bad take on your part saying all the Chargers/Broncos have is young QB's. As they also have great HC's who have a proven track record of winning and winning championships. While both will also be playoff teams this year as well. Just because the Raiders have Bowers, doesn't mean the team is in any position to contend in that division any time soon. Just having 6 of your games against those other teams is a huge hinderance in making the playoffs. So if Deion and the family are sitting back and looking at what places would give him a better chance at long term success, it's not going to be the division with the best HC/QB combo situations in the NFL. If Nix pans out (and it's looking like he should), that division is going to be BRUTAL for the next 10 years, they legit could have the best QB in the game, another Top 5 QB, and then wherever Nix ends up as.

I think the two New York teams would be the top 2 destinations for Shedeur in Deion's mind, especially of the teams who are needing new QB's right now. I think the NYC market would be so appealing for the Sanders family, if you can bring a SB to either NY team, you become a legend and have endless marketing opportunities. I know they seem to love the idea of him playing for the Raiders, but honestly, that is probably the worst situation any QB or HC should want to be in right now. That's a division where the other 3 teams have 2 sure fire HOF coaches and a 3rd who just won the NCAA NC and has been to a SB, as well as maybe the best QB ever in his prime, and two other great young QB's (I really like what I've seen from Nix this year). If the Raiders didn't have all that in their division I'd get the appeal, but the Raiders are so far behind those other 3 teams in the division, it's just not a situation I'd want to be drafted into if I'm a QB right now.

I don't think they're going to be #1 anyways, I think they beat the Bills who have nothing to play for next week. But I doubt any team is giving up a huge haul for either of these QB's, it basically is 2023 all over again and whoever is #1 would need a sucker out there like we were who makes a bad trade, not sure it's going to happen again without us in the running to be said sucker.

I'm long on the record as saying I don't think Shedeur is that guy, but he's still going Top 10. Because the Giants are taking a QB if either of those two are available, and then if either are available for the Raiders, I can't see them passing on either of them as well. There are still other teams like the Titans or even the Jets to take one if they're sitting there too. If Deion wasn't his dad though, then I could see it being like the Pickett year, but the Deion shine with be too bright for many to see through in the end.

What kind of math did you use to get there? Patriots and Jags = not QB needy Browns just restructured Watson, guaranteeing he'll be there next year too Leaves only 2 QB needy teams ahead of us, assuming the Titans move on from Levis this offseason and don't want to give him one last shot.

Yep, and the Jets played them, problem is they also played the 49ers, so a Lions win tomorrow would help the Jets there too. It's going to come down to the game tonight, if the Falcons lose we'll likely keep the 6th pick even after the Lions beat SF since it will add only 1 win but 2 losses to our SOS, but if the Falcons win I'm guessing that bumps us back to 7th for now.

Well something in one of the afternoon games caused the Jets SOS to jump a bit, we're now back in the 6th spot for the time being... but yea, we'd be 2nd right now if not for that win last week

In theory this makes sense, but not in reality. Because the reality is that the players and coaches on those bad teams are also playing for either their current jobs or auditioning for new ones the next year as well. So when both sides are really auditioning for next year, advantage goes to the bad starters who are still better players than the backups. Ownership and front office members who know they will be back the next year are the only ones who want them to lose for the draft positioning. So unless they go to the coaches and say, "your jobs are safe for next year, so please try to lose this game to help yourself with a better draft pick" then the bad teams are usually in a better spot to win those type of games.

Yes and no No, don't do it with any of the picks in the first 4 rounds, let those chips fall. But I'd be all for using all of the 5th round and later picks to get additional 3rd and 4th rounders which have a better chance on hitting. I'd rather have 2 more late 3rds or early 4ths than have the 6 picks in rounds 5 and 7. 11 rookies aren't making the Week 1 roster anyways, I'd package them all up for whatever we can get in the 4th round or better. And if we can't get them, I'd just trade them for picks in next year's draft where we might be able to use them to trade up for a QB if needed.

We went to OT against a team that was still alive in the playoff hunt. Winning or losing that game at that point would have zero affect on the culture that is being built right now, just being competitive and taking it to OT accomplished that job. Case and point, we won that game and then just got blown the F out this week. If we couldn't use that to build upon this week, do you really think it's going to have even the smallest affect on the team moving forward into next season? It's why I've said there is a HUGE difference between tanking and losing after a closely battled game. Showing the fight and losing a close OT game would have done the same thing for the culture but not hurt out draft position and ability to trade back with a QB needy team. And no, I don't think it's hyperbole when you're talking about 3 picks later at that point in the draft. If you're talking about 17 to 20, then yea, it's probably the same thing. But not in the Top 5ish of the draft, that's where every draft slot can have massive ramifications down the line. Just because great players were drafted after our pick doesn't mean us picking higher wouldn't have given us a better chance at hitting big on a pick. Going back and looking at the other players drafted later is the cherry picking, because the fact remains that the higher you pick, the better chance you have at getting a difference maker and there is no logical way to say it's not true.

And now that I think about it after my other post in a different thread about how I think NE beats the Bills next week. There is a very real chance that winning last week will end up costing us the #1 pick in the draft. Which means we could have traded back into about the pick we're going to end up having in the end. So that win last week will less be about the draft position it cost us, but more the additional draft picks we would have picked up by trading back to the same spot we'll end up. So that win might have cost us a couple extra future 1st round picks in reality.

I actually think there is a better chance NE wins next week than lose. The Bills are locked into the 2 seed, having absolutely nothing to play for, while the Patriots coaches are coaching for their jobs and so are a lot of players. I think NE wins next week unless the literally purposefully don't try to win and actually call plays that aren't designed to put up points, as I think the Bills will be resting anyone of significance.

Yes the Giants did, but so did we last week. We'd be sitting at #2 right now had we lost last week.

I'm sorry, but this is just absolute utter nonsense In general, the higher you pick, the better chance you have at not screwing up the pick. But your final point about not evaluating well means that's even more true. If you don't evaluate well, the lower you pick, the better chance you have at screwing it up because the more elite players are already off the board. So basically because you don't trust us to draft well, you'd rather win meaningless late season games in a lost season and make it tougher on us to hit on our next draft pick at the same time. That's how poo franchises continue to be poo. Win meaningless games that cost you a chance at true impact players and then draft questionable prospects who might not pan out and compound the issue. "hey guys, we suck at evaluating and drafting, so let's make it harder on us next year by drafting later so we can celebrate a pointless win that we'll forget about in a few days" make it make sense

I was responding to someone talking about Parsons, so I pointed out that using him as an example is horrible because he wasn't an edge rusher as a draft prospect. You responded to that by talking about the Horn pick, I was just re-iterating that my point had nothing to do with us, it was solely about Parsons being an anomaly who changed positions and why he's a bad player to use as an example of a stud being drafted outside the Top 10. So I could say, why do you keep going back to Horn, I'm not talking about Horn at all

I'd rather overpay for a legit pass rusher than overpay for someone like Higgins who we'd need to pay Top 5 WR money to get to even discuss coming here. T-Mac on a rookie deal plus an expensive pass rusher in FA will have a much bigger impact on the team than overpaying for a WR with a lower ceiling than T-Mac and drafting a bit of a project pass rusher.

Sure, and I think it's one of those things that comes down more to need than anything. But personally, I think he'd go ahead of Carter and Graham, and again, I personally rank him over Hunter as well. The Giants and Raiders winning though actually makes it less likely of Johnson falling to 7 anyways. There is a very real chance that neither of them feel these QBs are worth a haul to move up to get them, which if it's the case, it opens up 2 more players to be drafted in the Top 3 that aren't QB's

It has nothing to do with Horn and it has nothing to do with even the Panthers It's a general statement for all teams/fans who like to say, "but Parsons went 12th, blah blah blah" Parsons was a MLB, he was never going Top 5, even sneaking into the Top 10 would have been tough, people thought we were crazy to take Kuechly at 9 since he was a MLB, they just never go that high in the draft. Anyone who points to Parsons draft position compared to the player he is today is completely missing the point, he was NOT a pass rusher coming into the draft, so any talk about his draft position is just flawed, literally even the team that drafted him didn't see him being a pass rusher for them, it took injuries for them to find it. And no, you don't have the same chance at screwing up a higher pick. The higher your pick, the better chance you have at not screwing it up, that's just common sense.

I'd be surprised if he's still there at 7, personally I think he's the top CB in the draft (his size is the differentiator for me when comparing with Hunter)

Jets currently ahead of us by .002 in the SOS I'd love to know what has to happen over the final games this week and next for us to have a worse SOS than them, but that seems like WAY too much work to try and dig into and figure out lol