Icege

Going through this thread and other Brian Flores related topics is quite revealing.

A couple of things that stood out to me: During his senior season with ND, he only had 5 games where he threw for over 250yds His Sr Y/A was 8.2yds, but he only threw >= 8.2 in 6 games (2 of those where he did not throw for over 250yds) One of those games where he threw for over his Sr avg, he was pulled in the 1st quarter (and threw for under 250yds) His games vs. VT. Purdue. and Cinci gave me a tremendous amount of pause regarding his accuracy (a looooot of balls behind his WRs), ability to read a defense, and performance under pressure To be fair to Coan ofc, some positives that stood out for me: Looks to have an NFL-caliber arm despite playing in a college offense that did not often challenge deep unless a part of play action Though his ability to perform under pressure concerns me, his ability to respond to adversity did impress me especially when he came back into the game vs. VT to lead the squad to a W NFL size

His lack of experience (less than 20 games starting in college) is something that concerns me as well, but I also explain that away to myself by believing that it will translate him to being a fresh mold of clay. I'm still terrified by any prospect who is going to rely on this coaching staff to put them in a position to succeed, but if we had to throw a pick at a QB I'm very much on board with taking a shot on Aqeel Glass. I still have to watch Cole Kelley, Carson Strong, Bailey Zappe, EJ Perry, and Skylar Thompson before I declare Glass my favourite (read: not best!) QB prospect in this class. Anybody else aside from Willis caught your eye? EJ Perry is a name that I keep hearing about (hence him being on my final 5 to review).

Eleby had a sneaky good team at Western Michigan. Agreed though re: Willis. The more that I watch him, the more I'm seeing that he needs the right situation which we just don't have atm. Put him on a team that has a guy on the back end of their career with a QB coach that is willing to work to start with the fundamentals. There are just way too many throws where I find myself asking, "What in the world did you see there to think that that was the best option?" At the same time, his OL was atrocious so the obvious answer was probably, "A defensive lineman about to flatten me." Kelley and possibly Eleby can be alright. Coan is garbage. Absolute trash. Nothing about his game nor his stats support him being worth a damn. Ridder I can't quite get a read on yet. I don't think that he can be a franchise guy, but a competent QB2 to develop as a potential trade bait in the future? Maybe... I'm all in on Aqeel Glass.

Was at the game. Mint City Collective was incredible and made the entire game an awesome experience. The Battery flat out played tougher and more aggressive.

It's a stupid ass name for a team with a stupid ass owner.

Reddick was the exception, not the rule. You're not going to get a premiere pass rusher on a 1-year prove it deal every offseason. Luvu's contract is also very, very cheap. $4.5M doesn't even make him a top 50 contract hit for LBs.

I wouldn't mind rolling the dice on Gardner Minshew + Aqeel Glass, but any major QB-moves I want to avoid until after we find out whether or not Rhule will be gone.

Extend DJ. Robby can be cut after next season to save $12M with only $3M in dead cap for 2023. DJ, TMJ, and Shi could be a dirty WR trio for a competent QB/OC/HC.

Luvu's new contract ranks #53 out of all LBs in regards to cap hit for 2022. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/cap-hit/linebacker/ That's an incredible deal. That man Samir holding down the cap.

Let's goooooooooooooo!!!!!!!! Luvu was the most obvious of the upcoming UFAs to retain.

I got to watch them play down here against the Charleston Battery. The fan group that traveled was incredible. Wife and son were both raving that they wanted to go see a game in Charlotte because they made the experience so fun.

I would rather retain Frankie Luvu on a cheaper deal. He did well when given the opportunity last season and gives us a more affordable option at the position. I could maybe see Marquis Haynes fitting the role as well, but it sounds like the staff is going to let him walk. Originally I thought Josh Paschal could fill that role, but he appears to be more along the build of YGM (which means if the team can draft him, they can also move on from Morgan Fox...). Maybe the staff would consider bringing Chinn back up to that role? But if the man is willing to play for well below what he could get on the open market in the first season, sign him and pay him when there's cap space like they did with Moton!

It's not just Kenny Pickett's hand size holding him back. It's also the fact that against quality competition his numbers nose-dived.

NFL Twitter has been dragging Eli Apple and it is fuging glorious

Any QB train in this draft

Creed Humphrey was drafted in the 2nd tho?

I never made the point that a center has to have been a wrestler, that is yet another strawman that you are attempting to set up and knock down. I made the point that OL that are also wrestlers are known to have all of those transferrable skills that I listed. The other problem here is that you're looking for blurbs to further your argument without doing any actual research. You say that Wirfs is big but not an unreal wrestler because you saw him get pinned by the best OL in this year's draft and a guy under 6'. That short guy you showed is Aaron Costello and he was 55-0 as a heavyweight. He was a monster, but all you saw was a short guy that you thought would serve to denigrate Wirfs abilities as a wrestler which he also credits with helping him develop as one of the top OL in the NFL. Tristan was 25-3 and the Iowa high school state champion at heavyweight. Tell any wrestler that somebody was a state champ in Iowa as a wrestler, and there is no question over whether or not that guy is a good wrestler: Go quote where I said that centers are more valuable in QBs. At this point we might have to get you renamed to "strawbugs" because you have yet to respond to (nor counter) any supporting arguments that I've made. I don't get where you're getting that this is personal. Aside from joking around and saying to not Matt Rhule this when you were hyperfocused on a one inch height difference I can't see anything that comes across as personal in this direct back-and-forth. Would you mind pointing out where you got that impression?

No doubt. I just don't trust any of the current crop to be franchise QBs. I'd rather gamble a day 3 pick on Aqeel Glass who looks to have a tremendous amount of upside compared to other QB prospects that'll go on day 2. I'd also like to point out re: HBCU QBs the history of racism in the NFL that extends to today.

No to all 3. Take a shot on Aqeel Glass tho with a day 3 selection

You do understand that this entire post of your's is one straw man fallacy after another, yes? None of that addressed the transferrable skillsets that exist between wrestling and football, nor does it address the faux-issue being raised in regards to his size. The concerns were based on Linderbaum's size, which simply didn't hold up when we looked at the facts. I listed plenty of NFL centers that are the same size as Linderbaum along with his success as a wrestler to address the misinformed comments regarding the size of NFL centers as well as Linderbaum's ability to deal with larger opponents. Even if those opponents that you mentioned put the weight on, so will he, so I'm not sure why you're insisting that it's an issue here. The round that those centers were drafted in is irrelevant. They were examples of his size not being an issue. However, I am glad that you brought up the "value" of picking a center in the first round as many Huddlers have voiced that the team has just as good of a shot as finding a center on day three as they do days one and two. That too, is misinformed: 1st: Frank Ragnow, Ryan Kelly, Garrett Bradbury, Alex Mack, Cesar Ruiz 2nd: Mitch Morse, Rodney Hudson, Josh Myers, Creed Humphrey, Justin Britt, Ethan Pocic 3rd: Brandon Linder, Quinn Meinerz, Matt Hennessy, Lloyd Cushenberry III, Connor McGovern (DAL), Michael Deiter 4th: J.C. Tretter, Ben Jones, Tyler Biadasz 5th: Corey Linsley, Connor McGovern (NYJ) 6th: Ryan Jensen, Jason Kelce Drafting a center in the first round is not a bad thing. Drafting one at #6, if he's one of the top 6 players in the draft, is also not a bad thing. Would it be nice to play upon people's beliefs regarding positional value and leverage that against them to regain the team a day two pick while still landing Linderbaum? I'm all for it. However, in regards to the specifics of this thread, he's my favourite prospect in the draft and he's on that list of guys to get at #6. None of the QBs, imo, are worth the #6 pick. What Pro Bowl QB do you see in this draft class? Kenny Pickett? I have the ammo for that debate too if you want to venture into it

Not saying that wrestling alone makes him draftable. It's the transferrable skills from being a successful heavyweight wrestler that matters though in regards to addressing how he will compete against larger individuals. Hand fighting is incredibly important in the trenches. Kawann Short made a lot of money because of his quick burst off of the line and violent hands that kept linemen from latching on to him (up until he lost his burst when the lower body injuries started). A person with a wrestling background is going to have that experience with hand placement, hand fighting, leverage, flexibility, and toughness that are vital to being a competent offensive lineman. I would also argue that wrestling is much, much older than football and that "low man wins" is a carryover from wrestling. Quoting former Packers' DT Datone Jones... But yea, definitely not the sole reason he should be drafted. Just part of the story that makes him more intriguing to me when evaluating.

/wrist

What does Linderbaum pinning the best RT in the NFL show? That the handwringing over his size is uninformed at best. For one, he's literally the size of an NFL center with room to build mass. Second, with a 53-10 record as a heavyweight wrestler he clearly has no issue going head-to-head against other large (or larger) individuals. Third, he bullied the best RT in the NFL. Fourth, how can you be concerned about him getting a flag while at the same time possibly talking up trading down for Penning? If Wirfs looked bigger than Linderbaum, which he should since he's 6'5", that attests even more to Linderbaum's ability to out leverage and win vs. bigger opponents. I'm a huge fan because I've been watching him since last season when I had him as a sleeper day 3 pick for the Panthers (search for the earliest post on the Huddle for "Linderbaum." Is me! ). I'm a big fan of the center position and prefer OL to have a wrestling background so that they know how to deal with DL that have great hands (ie: Kawann Short) along with an innate sense for leverage. He rocketed up to the top offensive lineman in the draft. Duke Mayweather called the kid OL1 for this draft (and called Rashawn Slater OL1 for last year's draft). I've watched more Iowa games in the last two years than I have in my entire life to see that the kid is legit. I don't buy into the whole "That's too high to pick a center!!!" nonsense because only one player touches the ball every single play and that's the center. He's has to get that ball to the QB, the control tower of the offense. He has to call blocking assignments while being on the same page of said QB. He's got to be strong enough to be able to deal with nose tackles weighing over 320lbs while also being quick enough to get up to the second level and de-cleat linebackers. There was an article years ago that I am desperately trying to find that showed that, statistically, teams that lost their centers faired worse than teams that lost their starting QB. However, I do recognize that a lot of other folks do subscribe to the idea that it's too high for a center so I'm very much okay with trading down to acquire additional picks and the best OL in the draft. To add, the center is the second most expensive position on the OL after OT. Having a guy on a rookie deal will allow us to have a strong line at a fraction of the cost of what other teams have to pay. He might be taller than one of the listed centers, but he's the same height as five of them and only an inch shorter than the other five. Don't you Matt Rhule this! The only offensive lineman I'm near as excited for is Ikem Ekwonu. He is a friggin monster.

The idea that Tyler Linderbaum is "undersized" is incredibly uninformed. He's listed at 6'3" 291lbs fresh out of college without an NFL offseason. Now look at the following starting centers: Rodney Hudson (ARI) 6'2" 300 lbs Corey Linsley (LAC) 6'3" 301 lbs J.C. Tretter (CLE) 6'4" 307 lbs Jason Kelce (PHI) 6'3" 295 lbs Ben Jones (TEN) 6'3" 308 lbs Ryan Kelly (IND) 6'4" 309 lbs Matt Hennessy (ATL) 6'4" 295 lbs Garrett Bradbury (MIN) 6'3" 306 lbs Connor McGovern (NYJ) 6'4" 306 lbs Austin Corbett (LAR) 6'4" 306 lbs Matt Paradis (CAR) 6'3" 300 lbs People are really out here trying to get folks to believe that the kid can't put on 10 lbs of muscles under an NFL strength & conditioning program when Creed Humphrey weighed 302 lbs at the combine and is now listed at 320 lbs? I guess he's going to get pushed around by NFL DL just like Tristan Wirfs pushed him around when they... wayminit... Ok.