coffee

Only way I could actually see tanking would be if we were out of the playoff picture and the last couple games determined whether we'd get the #1 pick (and that there was a "can't miss" #1 pick hero that would be there.) Outside of that, I'd think it would do more damage than good. For example, I can only imagine what a player would think about a team that's willing to trash that player's rep and future employment. For many of them, it's their only chance in the NFL. Doesn't seem like that would draw many quality free agents either.

Right now, this team is Brad and I'm yelling "HOOOOOOOVE!!!"

I hate the guy on the field because I'm a Panther fan. But I'm very sorry they are going through this. I seriously doubt it has anywhere near as much to do with football as we think and as the reporters report.

Can you even imagine the fan reaction if we signed yet another retread QB expecting him to do better here?

I thoroughly enjoyed that article. Thank you for posting it! Of the "factions" we have in this thread, I'll go with those that are not sold on Fields yet and that the article paints a bad picture of Rhule but not of Fitterer. Unpopular view: Although Darnold's 5th year option was a bad decision in hindsight, it seems like simple math to me. Fitterer couldn't see the future, so he had to go with the math. Here were the possibilities if he waits: (1) SD is the answer at QB but we either lose him to FA or have to bid against a host of other teams to keep him at a huge price. LOSE (2) We don't see enough in one-year to know if he's the answer, so we either lose him or pay too much to see him for another year. LOSE (3) He sucks and I look brilliant for not exercising the 5th year option. WIN If he exercises the option: (1) SD's the answer and I look brilliant. WIN (2) We don't know yet, but I've given us the 2nd year we need to make the call. WIN (3) He sucks and I cost us an average of $11 million on the attempt and use him as #2 in year 2, or possibly as a mentor and stopgap for a drafted rookie's 1st year. LOSE Again, we NOW know. But the risk of losing your answer at QB vs. paying a bit too much for a backup/mentor seems like an easy decision. I think he took the correct risk even though it didn't turn out the way we wanted.

Oops. Shoulda said cut instead of traded.

I appreciate that Fitterer was upfront with CMC. One of the many things I disliked about Gettleman was that he didn't even tell Smitty he'd been traded. You can make the tough decisions without being a jerk.

You absolutely could be right. But the other way to look at it is: If we win the division, we suddenly become very appealing to a new coach and/or the next great QB dissatisfied with his current team. Especially considering we basically have two sets of draft picks to work with. This is certainly a glass-half-full/wishful thinking view when I'm not remotely convinced we can win the division yet. But, at least for me, that'll give me the reason to root for our guys to win. And to the OP, yes, it's shocking to be one game out of 1st in nfcs. Even more shocking to add to it that we are one game out of draft pick #1 AT THE SAME TIME. And undefeated in our division to boot. Screwy times.

I hope so. I'm not quite there with you, but I will say this: Baker has fans from Cleveland. If this was his normal play, he would not have had ANY fans. It would've been a universal "He's gotta go!" attitude. Obviously, he's not looking like our answer at QB right now but I do expect that we'll see a better version of him. Whether enough to move us to contender? Like I say, I hope so but I'm not quite there yet.

Great work, TC. I have only seen a small portion of the Giants game but I was encouraged to see that they only scored 13 points for the first 59 minutes of the game. And that was despite being a beneficiary of a muffed punt on the 10 yard line (approx). I think Jones will move the ball better than the Browns but it looks inevitable that he'll turn it over as well.

Forgive me if this is posted elsewhere. I accidentally missed about 19 of these 21 pages. Bill Polian on NFL Radio last night was clear that the intentional grounding call unfairly cost us the game. He said the most agonizing part was that they got it right, then converted to the wrong call. I respect his views and thought I'd share. As I said elsewhere, I don't believe it was a conspiracy. Just two bad calls made by refs in preseason form that happened to be at the worst time for us.

What says the Huddle? Huddle says "Great googly moogly!" https://youtu.be/4bgnBduAd4s

I look at it a bit different than that. There are two different mindsets as you say, but I think they are Coach vs. Player. We don't have the skills to be either one but we like to think we do. The fan who takes the "Coach" mentality likes to think "I found the problem and here's what needs to be done to solve it." The fan with the "Player" viewpoint feels we need to support our team and trust the system. Although the two viewpoints rarely get along, it doesn't change that both are correct and both are true fans.

We were terrible for 90% of the game but this is one we should've stolen if the refs didn't screw up so much. I don't think conspiracy but, man, we didn't need all the calls to go the wrong way. I think this will be one the games I always remember as lost due to officials. (The other was years ago against Dallas when Pep blocked a FG and we won... only to have the refs call a penalty for running into the kicker. The penalty should've been nullified by the fact that the ball was touched and, even though the replay obviously showed the ball changing trajectory when it hit Pep's hand, they claimed it wasn't clear and let it stand costing us the game.) Refs are still in preseason form but they also called delay of game on us, but let the Browns go on at least two snaps that went just as long. I think they'll end up acknowledging that the call against Burns and the intentional grounding no-call were mistakes. A lot of good it will do, though.

Close first half leaves us within a couple points of each other. We have two good drives that end badly because of sloppy penalties, a sack and a turnover. They move the ball but stall in the redzone. Second half has us starting to click. CMC scares the heck out of us by leaving injured for a couple plays but then returns to score the winning TD on a Baker pass.

A touchdown and 11 safeties would do it.

John Fox, is that you? BTW, great info to start this thread! Thank you!

OK. When I croak, you're hired to give my funeral discourse.

I actually should've said more than a few years ago. It was 2006.

Welcome. Forgive a long post but, ncsdawg, I think you'll enjoy it. A few years ago, I surprised my father with a trip to Charlotte for the Panthers/Browns game. Through odd circumstances, we got front row seats right behind the Panthers' bench. As always, the Browns had a huge following and an avid Browns fan couple sat right beside us. This day could not have been more perfect. We had the most enjoyable friendly "trash talk" with them. They were an absolute blast. Panthers got well ahead but the couple were as cordial as ever while still keeping up the fun trash talk. All the Browns fans seemed this nice. The Browns were not good at the time but that didn't dampen their spirit. They were there to have fun and watch football. I had a two-day perfect trip with my father including a Panthers win that was made even more enjoyable by this couple. My father died a couple years later. So, looking back, I actually did the thing you typically say "I wish I'd done this or that before I lost my dad." I'm not a Browns fan. I am a fan of Browns' fans. I doubt you were there but, by extension, I thank you for a day that I will treasure for the rest of my life.

Good idea, but it would be a hard sell. "Yeah, thanks for all your pop did. Sorry he kicked the bucket. Oh, by the way, his number's unretired."

And undefeated PJ'll win two games in garbage time while throwing 5 INTs.

Are you sure? "Kindness in women, not their beauteous looks, shall win my love." "Though she be but little, she is fierce." "For which of my bad parts didst thou first fall in love with me?" "Misery acquaints a man with strange bedfellows."

Me and my TV with fargin PANTHERS FOOTBALL on it! But the "matchup" I'll be anxious to see is not the normal "them vs. us." I want to see how Baker matches up with a healthy CMC who matches up with a revamped O-line. So, I guess it's our healthy/revamped O against their D.

Yeah, I was thinking that he's either got a really cool job or no job. And Blackpanther, nice spin job yourself!