micnificent28

Bro really???? Yall think Willis is this slow? Yall are reaching... smh

Don't think cam is faster than willis..Willis... you telling me Willis isn't running a mid 4.5 I think that's a stretch when his on field speed has been timed equal to kyler. His arm is Cam level coming out of college with the ability to change the speed and velocity on his throws which Cam still can't do. We using Ole Miss vs liberty to say he socks? Whole team was over matched.. how many qbs do we take their worst game of the year to define them and say this is who he is as a player..

Brady... has won what more than half the last few super bowls.. HE IS A UNICORN. But I guess we saying mahomes is a pocket passer Russell as well go look at the league bro. Those guys who are deemed pure "pocket passers" are a dying breed. That's not me exaggerating that's look at the starter for each team. Now how long do you think it's going to take for not pocket passers to win?

Here's the thing. Everyone is guessing.. I can point out a million measurements and numbers but that guy could still bust. But* the thing is the same can be said for guys who are deemed pocket passers or complete 70% of their passes whatever. Would I love to find the next Tom Brady sure... The question is how.. Tom Brady was a unicorn.. a needle in a haystack nobody saw coming dropped to the 6th round. Guys with traits that are average or decent are harder to identify as being an elite qbs because they don't stand out. If we are going to take a educated guess as to who the next great qb will be it's easier to spot if he does have freakish traits. Those I can see coming. I could see Josh Allen's all world arm or Staffords generational cannon those thinfd translate... you can't say who will just have some Fitzmagic like Fitzpatrick or so. If you have to make a pick you picking the guy with the traits or the Ole well he was good in college and my gut tells me guy? What can you quantify and show your work so to speak as to why you drafted this guy. That's my thinking..

That's fair... not telling you your wrong just asking your opinion. I'm usually here year round but don't post or comment as much until draft season because I find it fascinating. I enjoy the metric and numbers of it all trying to find out who will be the next Patrick Mahomes and so on. I think your a pretty logical guy and maybe the most respected opinion on the forum. We all want the best possible pick for the franchise I think it's easier to identify that guy if I can put a number,measurement, percentage or time on why a guy is successful. It's easier to find that than say whatever Brady has that just works.. that gift can't really be seen. If so he wouldn't have went in the 6th round.

I think the idea is to have that and then some. Having a rocket arm is 1 trait that allows you to do more than the average qb. When a guy says he can make all the throws it means he has the arm strength and rocket arm to fit throws in contested tight windows. Now that doesn't this is the only way to be successful but with the evolution of the NFL guys getting bigger and faster its important as ever.

A few things here I want to just state my opinion on where we differ. I think Jackson has a good arm.. but Newtons arm coming out dwarfs his in comparison. I think even Willis has a stronger arm than Lamar Jackson. I agree Jackson's accuracy seems better than both at any point. In terms of being more dangerous than Cam as a runner... I dunno what are we judging it on? Rushing yards or nose for the enzone? Are we saying the guy with the all time record for rushing touchdowns isn't as more dangerous than Jackson? I think they are just two different style runners. Newton is Jerome Bettis, Derrick Henry type power runner, while Jackson is Micheal Vick, Barry sanders type speed guy. Hard to compare Newton because we have never seen a quarterback that plays the way he played... I think a guy who has won a MVP.. no matter how is ELITE. Maybe he doesn't fit the brand of football you think wins football games but to beat every other guy in the NFL period to be number 1 even for a year means your damn good at football. I think as long as they have Jackson and a smart ravens front office and he remains healthy they have an above average shot at making the playoffs there for a decent chance at winning a championship.

Your doing the opposite of that tho. Your screaming no every quarterback that is able to run. Like his arm is dead and he will run everything and incapable of thinking between the ears. Basically mobile qb=can't throw. That isn't the case at all Mahomes being a prime example of that. Russell and kyler even more. I'm not expecting Willis to be Cam at all he was a once in a generation player. We have never seen a power rushing qb with a rocket arm and at 250 pounds and maybe never will again. At the least I hope Willis is around hurts at the best I say kyler... no where is he anything like Cam. He is able to change up the speed and velocity on his throws which Cam arguably still can't do which is why every pass is a fastball.

So how do you feel about Lamar Jackson. I have seen your theory of running qbs being silver or and pocket passers gold. How do you view Jackson? Can the raven win the super bowl with Jackson at qb?

This. Everything a qb with mobility gets hurt its because he runs to much. But if it's a pocket passer nobody thinks hey if he could have escaped the pocket it wouldn't have happened

I'm not saying he is the second coming of Jesus either. I have said if I had my Choice I go ickey/neal/ then Willis. In a year where qbs are not looking that great why look for the highest floor lowest ceiling type guy when the chance for not being that great is equal? If I'm at bat I'm going for the home run.. not another teddy Bridgewater is what I'm saying..

Ask yourself that after Brady retires... pocket passer have won the last few basically on the strength of him alone. He's the goat. But what's left is Lamar jackson.Jackson.. Hurbert, Mahomes.Mahomet.. Russell Willson, burrow, and every other I m not a sitting duck in the pocket.

Bo nix was a highly regarded and touted 5 star recruit. He is going to be afforded all the life lines and mistakes any first round pick for a NFL team would male because of the investment, but at the college level. Willis was a athlete and was moved around wasn't even sure to play qb I think he was thought of as a corner.

Bro.. news flash.. the age of the pure pocket passer is over... go look at the top qbs in the league most of them have some kind of movement ability. And having the ability to run doesn't mean that's all you can do. Having more ways to attack a problem is always better than oh I hope this happens.. Every top qb draft in the last I would say 8 years has run atleast a 4.7 or so... the college ranks just aren't pumping out Tom Bradys or Payton mannings anymore. You have the occasional Mac Jones but it's now the outliner instead of the main show. Pocket passers also fail at the next level so it's not just because a guy can run he won't be successful.

His speed looked as advertised based on his big run in the senior bowl..

Yes I know I'm just using that guys argument. Joe burrow is miles better than Haskins just like cam was a better qb than The Golden Calf of Bristol. Sometimes the situation dictates if your going to play... a decent qb who is already proven and a senior ahead of you doesn't mean he's a better qb at all. In which case you better off transfer to play. I'm answering his question if Willis was so good why did he leave Auburn and couldn't win the starting job.

Who really cares man... stop scouting the comp and look at the traits. You look for things that translate at the pro level. If people thought like you would Josh Allen have went where he did? And looked good enough to have trey Lance follow right behind him? These guys are coming from basically 2a ball but they have the traits that translate. Stuff you can't teach. You could also make the argument he didn't put up better numbers because his team sucked.

Most qbs aren't running the 40. Lamar Jackson didn't... Kyle Murray didn't. Like most of you are saying a qbs 40 time doesn't define how they are going to throw the ball so that isn't as important. Being fast is a bonus.. if you run a 4.4'4.5 people will say as expected.. but if you come out run a slow time like a 4.65 you lose a bit of interest is mystique. It's a smart business move. Look at what's happening to Hamilton for running a 4.6.

Well they said his on field speed at the senior bowl was equal to Kyler who ran what a 4.4.. that's what his compassion is based off of.

Why did Joe burrow leave Ohio state?

Agreed. But these are ideal situations.. not likely to happen but if I had my choice it would be those.

I didn't see the specific plays they got hurt on so I will defer. But over their careers* Lamar had been pretty durable and Murray been fine as well. Cam for being the running qb got hurt in the pocket.. there is no one hit that is going to take you out. Qbs get hit even in the pocket. Just because you run as well doesn't mean your going to get hit qbs slide and run out of bounds to avoid unnecessary hits. Burrow was a number 1 overall pick...consensus. those are rare. Plus even he isn't a statue.

This is all I'm saying these are my 3 ideal picks maybe ikey/Neal/Willis but these 3 at 6 plz. Or trade down

Why didn't corral? Why was his pro day worse than Willis?

Russell Wilson doesn't get killed.. Lamar Jackson, Kyle Murray who is 5 '10. He's playing at 230 at 6'0 which is consider big even for Rb standards. But he isn't going to be playing rb or running 100% of the time. I would definitely give him 5-7 designed runs a game to keep defense honest.. His accuracy doesn't look as bad as you make it out to be and when given the time he looks good. If was as bad a thrower as you make it out to be do you think all these teams and gms would be ranking him the number 1 qb? Come on now we gotta read between the lines. Guy isn't just a kid running around cause he can't compete a pass. That's nonsense.