BrisbanePanther

Exactly! The word makes the point makes itself. He's having a historic start to the season. If he finishes the year with 5400 yards 35 tds and 2 picks and they win their division after more coaces get film on him, then he's an all-time rookie for sure. We'll see how he does against New Orleans...because so far, Atlanta beat both Bryce and CJ, and they're not that good. But Stroud is not on this team. And I would hazard the guess that Philip Rivers always had better numbers than Eli, and Eli had some seasons where he looked downright pedestrian--if not awful. Not saying this would happen, but if Stroud turns out to be Rivers and Bryce turns out to be Eli, are we complaining at the end of their careers?

Yes, I said that Cam was an exception.

Agreed. But I also know that too many words can do this to people at times:

Reading these threads about Bryce has been...an experience, but I see two main competing themes here emerging about Bryce: Theme A. He needs a really good (or at least better) supporting cast and situation around him to have the best chance of success. Theme B. He shouldn't need a cast but should elevate his existing one. My question is: Who are the QBs that have not needed Theme A to win a Super Bowl? Win in the playoffs? Become a Pro Bowler? Consistently have winning seasons? Brady, Rodgers, Mahomes, Stafford (taken #1), Allen, Burrow (#1), Peyton (#1), Eli (#1), Luck (#1), Brees, Ben, Rivers, Wilson, Montana, Steve Young, Favre, Aikman (#1), Warner, etc etc etc all needed a great supporting cast to win, and all had great--if not HOF--coaching. Even QBs like Watson had Nuk, Tannehill had AJ, Romo had TO AND Witten, Matt Ryan (#1) had Roddy White AND Julio Jones, Jeff-frickin-Garcia (who I saw have to jump to pass) had TO AND JJ Stokes, Culpepper had Moss AND Carter, and even Carson Palmer (#1) didn't look his best until he had Fitz in Arizona. None of them did anything with just JAGs--each of them all had/have at least one position player that defenses had to respect. Cam (#1) and McNabb might be the closest, but even McNabb didn't make a Super Bowl until he had TO. My point is that if Bryce falls in Theme A (which he clearly seems to) what makes him less or worse than the others--particularly at this stage in his career? Happy to be proven wrong but I can't think of too many QBs of different sizes and abilities who did it all by themselves or "elevated" a team on a long-term basis that wasn't already on the lofty side to begin with.

Hogwash. Stop making excuses for Bryce! Am I doing it right?

This keeps being a weird take, because if he did nothing during that time, the criticism would be "he can't even do anything during garbage time" or if Reich just ran draw plays it'd be "they don't even trust him during garbage time." Yes, it was garbage time, but if it helps establish rapport and some kid of rhythm with receivers during in-game action on the road, that's productive.

These the same fans that get all upset when national talking heads have Carolina ranked at the bottom of pre-season power rankings? Those fans who claim that "duh mediuh" is against us? I can't think of one time that the talking heads have gotten Carolina's power rankings wrong. Just because fans drink blue Cheerwine every off-season doesn't make them a reliable source of narratives. We were ranked at the bottom of the power rankings (again). Maybe we should pay attention from now on.

Strongly disagree. This is the thinking that has us here right now. Paying him will do absolutely nothing positive. If he signs that extension on October 9, people will hate him and call his contract an albatross by October 12--if it takes that long. We get on this treadmill of, "we have to pay so and so" and on and on it goes until we can't wait to get them out of here as they're deemed "overpaid". It happened with KK and bunch of other defenders, and it even happened with Cam, CMC, and DJ on the offensive side of the ball. I believe there was total Huddle frustration over the old regime paying people to "keep them in the family". No, get Burns out of here ASAP. Send him to New England. They're not making the playoffs in that division even with Burns, but at least they won't be embarrassed. Belichick will give up 2 #1's. On the back of the last two weeks, now is the time to strike while the iron is hot. I know we like to stare at our navels, but they look way worse than we do. Fitt should have had a voicemail waiting on Bill as soon as he finished his presser.

I actually agree with this, which is why I don't think the trade was the end of the world or that "we mortgaged our future" even if Bryce doesn't work out. We have our whole draft in 2025 (except the #2). I know we're in 2023 where life stories are told in 15-second TikTok videos and two weeks is an eternity, but even if everything goes completely wrong, the whole thing resets in about 18 months or so. If Bryce doesn't work out, I'm personally in favor of the hard reset that everyone has been avoiding. Don't do stupid extensions, no matter who it is--Burns, Brown, Horn, no one. Trade them or let them leave and collect comp picks. Clean out the front office and replace them with a new staff--particularly the scouting department. Clean out the coaching staff and be ready from someone like Slowik or Johnson.

Trade him to whoever delivers a first this year. A player is a bonus. My choice: Call Belichick now and get their 2024 #1 and 2026 #1 or 2025 #2 and maybe JuJu or Hunter Henry. He has been embarrassed the last two weeks (losing 72-3) and he's not going out like that. He's not drafting a rookie QB again, no matter who it is. He'll sign Cousins for a last attempt at a run. Roll with Bryce, Mingo, JuJu and the new #1 receiver in 2024. If it doesn't work, on to 2025.

I predict 52-21 Miami. I now accept that we may actually be 0-17...or at best 1-16. Tennessee is the only winnable game left.

They have just been a smarter franchise overall, no matter what they have done. Let's see, they make Shanahan coach--and don't fire him when they have rocky seasons. They put John Lynch in the front office--who I believe didn't have much or any experience when they did so. Oh, and they traded a ton to draft Lance...and you wouldn't even know it. How good are they? McDaniel, Ryans, and Slowik come from their system. Not bad. FWIW, the other SF franchises--Warriors and Giants--are overall in good shape too. They're just smarter out there when it comes to sports. All of Charlotte's teams have been owned and run by people who can make a bunch of money from an asset, but can't make that asset work.

There are way too many players that we do this for. If we evaluated ALL players from the beginning like we're doing Bryce this year, maybe we're not in the position that we're in.

We have never even sniffed that level of trickeration in the franchise's history. It's almost like the team is wired to be boring and conservative in its play. A bit like the Titans actually.

Huddle says that Bryce is too?

I note that I follow the Texans because I'm a Rockets fan, lived in Houston for a while, and the Rockets forum is also the best Texans forum. Here's the thing about Houston's OL...maybe their backups are actually better than Carolina's starters, which would speak to depth and their GM who came from New England. Just because someone is a "starter" is all relative to what you have available on your roster and the quality of the talent evaluator making the designation. I mean, Zavala is a starter. Regardless of the circumstances, that choice should put this whole "starter" business to rest alone. The scary thing is to imagine what Stroud would be like (or what Bryce would have been like) with Houston's starting OL. The funny thing is how much better a franchise looks when they get the QB right. This time last year their fans were eviscerating their owner and saw him the same as Tepper...actually worse in some respects because they thought he was a no-nothing who was controlled by (and would never fire) Easterby. They all also were convinced that Caserio was on his way out due to the state of the franchise after the Watson fiasco. The Texans even tried to distract the fan base with talk of new jerseys and fonts and colors in the off-season even.

Can I interest you in a history where a lot of Carolina fans on this very forum actually thought that Dalton was better than Cam at times? In fact, they looked at Dalton and compared him to Cam in the same fashion that Stroud and AR are being compared to Bryce. Better pure passer and all that. Weird but true.

I was never in favor of Fitt and I think people gave him the benefit of the doubt due to his Seattle connection. He never really earned the hype that he got here (which was an insane amount). We should have known it was pyrite as soon as he pointed to his mentor being from the Jets organization. Burns should not be on this team--no matter what people say. In fact, I'd guarantee that people are feeling less hopeless about Bryce if he sent one of those Rams #1s to Chicago rather than our own. In fact, I'd even say that many would at least point to the hope of someone like Harrison being drafted as Bryce's #1. They'd still hate to see Stroud and AR in comparison, but the all-hope-is-lost wave coming over the fanbase (even though I think it's still premature) would be tempered.

I don't remember any celebration at all in the early Tepper days. All I remember is a ton of anger that a brash Yank was picked over local-ish Navarro to buy the team from local-ish JR. Tepper hasn't helped himself a lot since then, and the rest is history.

Not sure that computes, because then you're assuming Tepper makes a good hire, which teh Huddle would say is an impossibility. So dud GM now using a pick to trade for a proven play or dud future GM drafting an unproven player. Not sure it's a hard decision ATM.

With this GM, they're as good as lottery tickets. Better to use them as currency for someone more proven.

One other potential pot 'o NIL gold for him and others: NCAA FB should still be coming back as a video game next year. I don't know what that game made in the past, but it surely wasn't chump change. I also don't know how the players will get paid from the revenues, but Caleb will easily be a top earner...maybe the highest depending on how they divide the money.

I think this is the key and why his threat is legit. He already has big money, and the powers that be in LA will be throwing a lot more at him to stay for one more year (you could argue that SC is still LA's #1 football team). He would also be getting more due to B1G's greater reach. His payday would be eyewatering to play for a good team in LA for a QB-whisperer coach that will have him set up to win the Heisman...with fewer games, less pressure, and the college lifestyle. It's the ideal scenario like Peter Pan where he can delay growing up--AND get handsomely rewarded in the process. The NFL team that wants him will need to probably throw whatever they can at Riley--especially if they aren't on his list.

He may not be thinking that far ahead...but Luck avoided coming to Carolina only to go to Indy, which may or may not have been a better landing spot--he did retire early after all. I suspect he could pull an Eli if one of his five teams aren't in a position to draft him #1 and refuse to play for them or telegraph it by who he visits. Traditionalists would hate him and say "they'd never draft him" but there will be more than a few desperate teams who would do what it takes to draft him.

You may be right about Caleb, but I'd guess that LA NIL money is probably substantial--and maybe enough to keep him if he doesn't like how the draft order shapes up. The main thing though is that he's already shown that he could play this "I'm not going there" game with teams, and we have no reason to believe Carolina wouldn't be on his no-go list...especially if the franchise is as trash as we all say it is.