BrisbanePanther

Sigh...so tanking for one year was much better. Keep all picks, pick the QB you want, and keep maximum salary cap. Those treadmill wins...at least they built culture needed for an 0-17 season.

I did a whole post on this and was linked to meth use so...yeah.

Don't disagree. The irony is that that was the kind of team the Huddle was looking before pre-draft trade, right? "Don't get a QB now", "we have too many holes", "build the team first and plug the rookie QB in later" were all common points. They overestimated their surrounding talent--that part is clear, but they honestly seemed to have thought they were at the "plug the rookie QB in" stage already. They clearly aren't there yet and Bryce is in a position at a point that he wasn't supposed to be. If he continues to improve despite all that, football people around the league will notice and his criticism will reduce.

I actually don't mind that aspect and it should keep the organization active--counter that with Cam where they were absolutely lazy and didn't get him the cast he deserved. If Bryce didn't need a cast, the same would happen again--we'd be complaining that they don't give him any help. Now they have no choice.

See, I think this is common sentiment in the Huddle because we are Panthers fans who are accustomed to Dollar Tree-level GM performance. Every year there seems to be at least one trade where we're shocked see certain players be traded for a bag of beans OR we see a team get a Brinks truck return for a certain player (like the Burns offer). Yet we keep saying that our players won't recoup much or that we have to pay more than we think is reasonable for a player. If Burns is on Detroit (I'm talking two-years ago Detroit, not this year's good Detroit) no one blinks an eye at a team giving a 1st + a playmaker for him. Same for if he's on Miami or Kansas City or SF or even Tampa--places where credible GMs are in place.

Yes, that Burns for Williams + a 1st looks like a very good deal. Especially if it's a 1st for 2024.

Don't know if he actually would, but he would spend all off-season trying to fake us all out like he could and he'd be the only one looking like a dope.

So you're saying that Fields got a whole two years before the "bust" label? Hmm... Btw, we really need to stop with the x-ray navel gazing as a fan base and be a bit more level headed in our (justifiable) criticism. The Bears are nationally and even locally known to be a colossally badly-run organization and have been for a long time. People are actually questioning if it's time for the Halas family to give up the team. I get that people are down on Bryce, but down on him to the point of giving kudos to the Bears?

Nah. College yards are shorter. Or maybe it was an Arena League field?

Isn't Tua still playing for a contract? And wasn't he last year pre-concussions? And I thought there were rumours that Ross was trying to move on from McDaniel last year. We forget Miami was also a bit of a dumpster fire last year too (and many before that). I don't think Carolina gets healing as quick as they did (we don't have a McDaniel). Winning cures all. I fully expect Bryce to have a significantly better end of this year and year 2, and I fully expect him to say that the "game just slowed down", which is what all rookie QBs say if/when they turn the corner.

I was thinking more like Jeff Garcia in his Pro Bowl years as a floor. He was seemed less gimmicky than Flutie but still had the "I-can't-believe-this-dude-is-in-the-NFL" stature that Bryce will always have.

Yes, how many who pooed the tankers are also angry with what was given up in the trade to go to #1?

Yep. Go ask Byron Leftwich how that worked out for him. Could've been coaching Lawrence now, btw.

That makes 30 teams teams then. If Chicago drove a harder bargain or Vegas offered Adams he'd have been someone else's #1 overall pick. Or did we forget that "trade Fields and draft Bryce" was a real discussion a few months ago.

My reaction exactly. If certain teams want your guys, you need to keep them.

I still find this topic a bit off. I could see if this were the situation where Levis was picked #1 because Carolina/Tepper/whoever was trying to outsmart the rest of the league, but we picked the guy that was the near consensus #1 prospect--who Houston or Indy would have picked if given the chance, which they tried to take with Chicago. If he doesn't work out, then maybe the NFL Scouting and Publicist Industrial Complex collapses right with the S2. Maybe they should collapse anyway because in two straight years, Willis and Levis cratered (ironically to Tennessee). Most analysts seem surprised at both Bryce's and Stroud's current play, which means they didn't expect it. It'll be interesting to see reactions if/when Bryce has his "Tennessee game" from last year. Stroud has had a bunch of UGA games, but we'll see what happens when he has his "Northwestern game".

Agreed. Oh, and let's remember that the only reason the Texans even exists is because they offered a $700m "stop ignoring us" expansion fee to get that team when the league was determined to give one to LA, despite LA never getting its act together. Other than Watson, QB play for them has been the likes of Carr, Schaub, and TJ Yates. They're only eight years newer than Carolina but they seem to have had more futility.

Much appreciated!

The not-consensus #1 pick-Blaine Gabbert? The same Blaine Gabbert that Jacksonville traded up to draft at 10 cause they missed out that other QB star Jake Locker? The same Blaine Gabbert that many on the Huddle wanted instead of Cam? Btw, it's always a weird retort. "Cool, now do an example of the opposite of your point." May as well ask how long is a piece of string. It's like asking someone to do Tepper or Jimmy Haslam in a thread about Bob Kraft. Fentanyl is a dangerous drug.

Let's stick with the Eli analogy then. Rookie year, 1-6 record as a starter with just over a thousand yards passing, and that one win was the last game of the season. He had a game during his rookie year with a 0.0 rating. He may not have had 200 yds passing all year--and that's with Jeremy Shockey, Tiki Barber, Ron Dayne, and Amani Toomer on offense. He had good coaching (Coughlin). NY gave up Rivers, another 1st, a 3rd, and a 5th to get him. Huddle (actually everyone in the social media era) would have said the same thing about Eli then--"he ain't it". He won the Super Bowl in year four. The irony is that he replaced Kurt Warner on that team, who EVERYONE thought was washed...until he went to Arizona and was the old Kurt Warner again.

It really is the best!

Exactly! The word makes the point makes itself. He's having a historic start to the season. If he finishes the year with 5400 yards 35 tds and 2 picks and they win their division after more coaces get film on him, then he's an all-time rookie for sure. We'll see how he does against New Orleans...because so far, Atlanta beat both Bryce and CJ, and they're not that good. But Stroud is not on this team. And I would hazard the guess that Philip Rivers always had better numbers than Eli, and Eli had some seasons where he looked downright pedestrian--if not awful. Not saying this would happen, but if Stroud turns out to be Rivers and Bryce turns out to be Eli, are we complaining at the end of their careers?

Yes, I said that Cam was an exception.

Agreed. But I also know that too many words can do this to people at times:

Reading these threads about Bryce has been...an experience, but I see two main competing themes here emerging about Bryce: Theme A. He needs a really good (or at least better) supporting cast and situation around him to have the best chance of success. Theme B. He shouldn't need a cast but should elevate his existing one. My question is: Who are the QBs that have not needed Theme A to win a Super Bowl? Win in the playoffs? Become a Pro Bowler? Consistently have winning seasons? Brady, Rodgers, Mahomes, Stafford (taken #1), Allen, Burrow (#1), Peyton (#1), Eli (#1), Luck (#1), Brees, Ben, Rivers, Wilson, Montana, Steve Young, Favre, Aikman (#1), Warner, etc etc etc all needed a great supporting cast to win, and all had great--if not HOF--coaching. Even QBs like Watson had Nuk, Tannehill had AJ, Romo had TO AND Witten, Matt Ryan (#1) had Roddy White AND Julio Jones, Jeff-frickin-Garcia (who I saw have to jump to pass) had TO AND JJ Stokes, Culpepper had Moss AND Carter, and even Carson Palmer (#1) didn't look his best until he had Fitz in Arizona. None of them did anything with just JAGs--each of them all had/have at least one position player that defenses had to respect. Cam (#1) and McNabb might be the closest, but even McNabb didn't make a Super Bowl until he had TO. My point is that if Bryce falls in Theme A (which he clearly seems to) what makes him less or worse than the others--particularly at this stage in his career? Happy to be proven wrong but I can't think of too many QBs of different sizes and abilities who did it all by themselves or "elevated" a team on a long-term basis that wasn't already on the lofty side to begin with.