KSpan

I specifically said somewhere that they went back to standard rushing once Carolina got deep into Atlanta territory. And whether you agree with my use of prevent or not, it doesn't change the fact that they were not applying pressure and were not in difficult coverage. Just give it up already.

I posted the rest, and no, no it doesn't. The fact they were doing it at all is ridiculous and incredibly stupid but it's there.

Attempt to split hairs if you want, but the fact remains. Zero pressure, zero attempt to get pressure.

It's man 2-high with the line not even rushing. It's there on film. You even arguing that is what's bizarre. Seriously... on film In fact, watch the first 3 passing plays on the drive. Same crap the whole time. Compare it to Campbell's sack in the 2md quarter, which was also a 4-man rush. Or again, just keep ignoring it. Your prerogative. https://www.nfl.com/games/falcons-at-panthers-2023-reg-15?active-tab=highlights

Watch the play in actual motion, specifically the defensive line. Anyone arguing that Atlanta was NOT in contain/prevent is blind. Those linemen weren't rushing, they were all containing with pressure being a far secondary concern. They didn't actually turn it back on until Carolina got well into Atlanta territory. Or hey, keep arguing the nonsense despite what's actually on the film. Your prerogative.

Because game manager implies limited ability, especially when it comes to general playmaking.

My thought exactly. Bryce has been subpar overall and especially poor deep downfield, but if actual evidence exists to the contrary that doesn't look like this, I'll stand corrected.

I had no idea that Haynes was already 30 until they mentioned it in the broadcast. Dude has had an incredibly nondescript 6-year career.

That seems some major reaching there, both the claims of not seeing it in other threads (it absolutely HAS been there, myself included) and the Bryce was somehow taking stuff off because of the weather. Bryce's throws have been slow all season, and it takes all of his frame to get any kind of oomph. I'm not sure what else to really say beyond that, as it is abundantly clear; his throws are consistenly underthrown and take forever to reach their destination. If there's anything Bryce does not need to do, it's throw the ball slower.

I appreciate that sentiment. With respect to the post, I am just disagreeing with the football assessment - IMO it's highly inaccurate to call it 'the work of a franchise QB and a guy worthy of a #1 pick', nor was it an 'incredible drive for any QB'. It was NFL table stakes-type performance with zero pressure in his face for much of it, evidenced by Atlanta's defense ging AWOL on the film itself after they shut him down all game long (thanks Arthur), and inaccurate and weak throws still mostly the result; those are throws that an average HS QB could and should make except for perhaps the Chark catch (addressed in a prior post). It was no different than the Bryce that we've seen much of the year but because the team won, such performance is suddently being lauded as something it can very objectively be argued that it's not. That's pretty much it. Doesn't make sense. It's a crappy season with very little to be excited about and better to win than lose, but IMO that doesn't mean we have to or should accept what amounts to baseline NFL QB performance as something great. Kyle Carolina has seen this movie already - Kyle Allen, for example. It's totally fair to expect more.

Where have I cheered for them to lose? Nowhere. Would I like to see them winning and be wrong? Absolutely. But because I saw what was happening, it was clear that wasn't happening. And talking a counterpoint to the roses and sunshine that inexplicably pops up does not make us bad fans. It's not complicated. Being objective does now equate to being miserable, as there is nothing I can do about it. Been a fan since 1995... 7 winning seasons... no one hangs around this team if they can't roll with the punches. But being unrealistic, if not downright delusional, can be painful when the reality sets in.

Good for you. Back in the offseason and presesaon, who was right about how this season would go and who was wrong? Perhaps you view these opinions as insufferable because we're right and the rose-colored crew are actually sort of miserable these days... sucks to have reality disrupt fantasy. Uh yeah, it absolutely was contain and prevent. Watch the tweet again, specifically the DL. The ends are going up and out, literally standing there, and the DLs are not pushing at all. I'll link it again here, and that's not even saying anything about the throw that was maybe impacted by the weather and maybe wasn't? That's the throw we got from him having the most space around him he'll ever have in an NFL pocket. A lot of his throws look like that though so impossible to say.

Holy crap, ths insanity with this stuff. Who gives a crap if this was 'the best game-winning drive' in years - it was still subpar play by objective football standards, especially Atlanta just gifting it. Full stop. Atlanta quit rushing the passer and inexplicably started playing prevent (watch Electro's tweet and tell me they're actualy rushing... they aren't), Bryce's throws were underthrown and slow as they commonly are sans the one to Chark that I'm not convinced was intentional becasue of his other accuracy issues, and he was dogcrap for the first 50 minutes of the game. I'm not miserable at all - the bar is just so low with some of you that this crap football gets celebrated. Seriously, how is it being miserable to call things objectively? Takes like yours were a dime a dozen this offseason, including the snark about 'being miserable' and other similar things, but lo and behold I and those sharing my opinions were right. This season has been utter crap and it could be predicted a mile away by anyone paying attention. If y'all are going to come in with nonsense like this thread then it's completely fair to have an opposing viewpoint.

If late, slow, not terribly accurate throws are what you want from a #1 pick, go for it. Typically though, the bar is higher.

It means as much and will have as much impact as his demeanor after the Texans game.

People that use the word 'hater' in discussions like this are not smart people.

Would you be saying that if they had somehow botched it on 4th with no time remaining? I bet not, a la the Cowboys chip shot in 2006 where Romo fumbled the snap. I bet win probability between kicking on 3rd and leaving a few seconds on the clock vs kicking on 4th with zero margin for error is pretty insignificant. I'ts all moot anyway. They made the kick and won the game - the decision worked out as is was overwhlemingly likely to. It's just alternate scenarios that could also have very strong odds of success while retaining other benefits.

Eddy made the kicks and the games turned out how they did, so that is what it is. It is not speculation though to recognize how defensive decisions accommodated those final drives, and while the offense can only play against the defenses on the field it always confuses me when teams stray from defensive strategies that have worked for an entire game in favor of the prevent. At least find a middle-ground or something, but don't suddenly just let a QB hang out, especially with how bad the Panthers receivers are. It's about the only fomrula that would allow them to score and yet Arthur Smith did it anyway.

The first 50 minutes were atrocious - that is certainly eligible for critique. Prior to that last drive the team was something like 2-12 on third down and Bryce had barely over 100 yards passing. As I said before, most of those throws on the last drive were NFL minimum at best and were still low quality, and had Atlanta not inexplicably gone into prevent and turned off the pressure (DL clearly went into contain mode) this isn't even a discussion. It took a team reverting to playing no actual defense for this to happen... I just don't understand the praise. He and the offense have been so bad this year that the bar has fallen so far to make this level of play seem impressive. Hell, Ridder only three for 15 fewer yards but had a TD. If not for that awful interception he had a better day than Bryce, or at least as good, but folks seems happy to roast him.

And in the early 2000s before the rule changes really benefitted the offense - I think that's something that really gets lost when people atrtempt to compare rookie years from guys that played 20+ years ago. Bryce has all of those benefits and still looks as poor as he does.

Brees did not look 'awful' his first years, and with respect to this discussion about Bryce you could still tell that the physicla tools were there regardles of how he was playing. That is Bryce's biggest issue - the tools aren't there, and it's a very, very slim chance that his physical traits like arm strength appreciably increase from where they are now. Bryce's arm looks exactly how it did in college, but the NFL is faster than things were in college. I'm open to being shown a QB whose arm strength increased notably form college to the NFL, as I can't think of one. Unless that somehow Bryce's ceiling will always be capped and based on what he's showing this year the 'processing' and other intangible items are not as advertised either.

I still somewhat disagree with Tabor's approach to leave all TOs in their pocket and wait until 1 second left on 4th down to kick that. For exactly the reasons you mentioned I would have liked to see them still run the clock down but instead kick on 3rd down. There would have been maybe 15 seconds left on the clock when Atlanta got the ball back. They were behind, not tied, so if anything goes wrong there they lose. On the flip side though, if you can't execute that kick in that situation then you deserve to lose. That said, I also understand the K balls are kept protected on the sideline. Perhaps the ball itself was nearly dry.

Amen. The takes around this drive are just crazy. Like, what game did people watch? This was barely NFL competence, if even that.

Why would there be? The Falcons gifted this game, Bryce and the offense were pathetic for 50 minutes of the day, and one win doesn't change nearly a decade of crap team management nor the brutally dim prospects of the very near future. There is no agenda - this is truly a reflection of where even maybe hardcore fans are at.