CRA

It's only made up in your mind because you choose not to read words. As starters in 2025. Comp % - Shough Pass yards per game - Shough Rush yards per game - Shough QB rating - Shough Yards per attempt - Shough TDs per game - Young Turnovers per game - Young Bryce is a #1 overall pick, year 3 starter. Shough is a 2nd round rookie nobody on a worse team. That my friend, is a red flag of a team doing it wrong. That team is us. and we shouldn't be talking Shough in terms of making BY look bad. We should be talking about the Carolina kid Drake "Drake Maye" Maye making us look really bad.

You don't seem to be a Panther fan. You seem to be a fan of a player. Me? I don't want bottom-tier offense for my team. Which is the entirety of the Bryce era. Both from a team and individual aspect. Being a Panther fan isn't about pretending Bryce is better than he is.

yeah, I think Egbuka was the slight betting fav going into last Sun. Tmac now jumped him. Tight enough Egbuka could jump back this weekend (Phins vs Hawks is a good setup for him to). So, I think the OROY is simply the result of the Panther/Bucs final. Pending one doesn't go ham in a losing effort I think the playoff team gets the OROY.

I mean, I largely spoke about Shough initially going into the week we played the Saints (and was right about why we needed to talk about him)......and now in a thread about OROY. Seems about right to me. You want to talk about Sam Darnold? I can do that because it would make sense to right about now as well.

well, last week he had 6 pass attempts over 20+ yards. Fair to say, he was consistently trying to keep the Jets honest in a game that was literally all on his shoulders from the jump given they are out of RBs in NO. the Saints managed a win despite putting Shough in the exact scenario you essentially guarantee to lose in w/ young QBs. Going all QB essentially w/ the gameplan. I do not think the film has had time to catch Shough yet. It will. Then you have to see if he can respond to that. But yeah, he is a pretty cool little story if you are largely a NFL fan/talker. I mean, if we had prime Cam Newton and no worries at QB.....I think the reaction to talking QB play in the NFCS right now might be a little different. Don't think people would freak out because the Saints hit a little streak and we compliment the dude from out of nowhere (and the out of nowhere part is basically why it's talked about)

I give zero shits about Tyler Shough. I do think it is relevant to see where in our own division a random 2nd rounder on a worse team.....is presently outplaying our #1 overall pick in his 3rd season. And of course, if you are talking about rookie play....yeah, Shough deserves some props. Which is why I also keep bringing up Fannin Jr. They deserve some mentions given they have virtually a zero % chance to win because they came out of nowhere vs favorites/media darlings at their spots and are late to the party. and outside of what you are trying to do here....I think most know my Shough posting is really Bryce Young posting. It's getting to the Bryce issue via another channel.

agreed. Lack of games/opportunity makes him a non-factor in OROTY talk. He is just now getting the stage where there is legit film on him. Takes awhile to really see how guys react to all the different scenarios and to find the real weak spots on a QB's play in an O.

his completion % and yards per game in starts would put him in top 10 in both those categories. team win % is also the same as Bryce while sporting a higher QB rating and QBR in his starts as well. For a 2nd rounder on a bad team......it is flat out very good play. That's not LOVING Shough. It's just talking NFL football. I mean, this could be his Kyle Allen window minus the absurd fumbles and he disappears. But it's clear some can't handle Shough being talked about purely because of how it reflects on Bryce (which ruins a TON of NFL QB talk).

in starts, he has played better, been more efficient and outproduced Bryce by virtually every statistical metric that exists in 2025. And has the 2 head to heads over Carolina. I mean, your jaw should hit the floor. But not for the reason you are implying. That freaking stings. Denying these realities isn't going to help the Panthers build a better team going forward.

He is basically having a polar opposite rookie season than Bryce. 4-3 as a starter on a very bad team. 68% for 237 passing yards and 19 rush per game. 9 TDs, 6 TOs in his starts. and folks acknowledge the surprisingly play because no one thought poo of the random 2nd rounder and he is player better as a rookie thus far than so many prized picks did as a rookies (not just Bryce but a boatload of dudes). It's only a sour issue to give someone props because he is a Saint and of course the Bryce thing. It's like giving the TE in Clev props for having near identical production as the chosen one Tyler Warren. Fannin is having a great rookie season in a very bad spot.

it still gets really weird when folks want to not isolate numbers for backups that enter a games and log 0 pass yards. It distorts all of their stats if you compare them to actual starters. Shough is 4-3 as a starter on a very bad team. In this starts he is: 68% for 237 passing yards and 19 rush per game. 9 TDs. 6 TOs. That's dang good play for a 2nd round pick thrust into the role midseason on a bad team. It flat out is what it is. Shough flat out deserves some props. If folks here can't do that, it's just Saints hatred or Bryce insecurity preventing football talk. I mean, he is producing. Carrying a big load and winning. In the type scenario people use to justify excusing Bryce's entire rookie year (minus the playcaller, Shough has that) ALL THAT SAID, he is too late to the convo. It's a 2 man race. Last 2 games likely decide between the WRs.

298 yards per game, 20 points per game to 306 yards per game, 19 points per game What has been clear, is the improvement from 2024 to 2025 that isn't Bryce Young. We have wins this year because we went from historically bad defense, to NFL average defense. That's a HUGE jump. Offense remains inefficient, low ceiling.....and basically hang their hat on making 2-3 plays a game and that going our way at an unstainable rate. So many of the look at X game for improvement....is the Panthers O and Bryce not being good for the majority of the game and just catching a play or 2. We all know I want Bryce gone. But if Bryce isn't gone....you need a new OC, new skill talent and have to take all sorts of steps to fix this O if we are ever going to matter. Because we do not have good offense. Everyone should be able to at least agree the offense is not good enough and this is a really quirky season.

I always feel like the Pro Bowl to a large extent rewards so many guys for the prior season vs the current one. It's really weird. DB missing last season really hurting him. we have seen that before with DB. Dominate season. No Pro Bowl. Catches it the next year.

Yeah, and if you are rookie Ward with the Titans he is going to try to make chicken salad with chicken poo. If good games don’t exist then he goes with whatever they have (like Bryce year 1 and or even year 2). But give him options he wants a good game to review. Fans will watch it more so than the bad….and his entire purpose is eyeballs/clicks and growing his presence in that space. I get it. Ideally I think the sweet spot is sort of AZ, Rams, etc. Games that sort of have a wild ride of play to dive into but leaves the fans feeling good

I would assume it’s a pretty simplistic math formula. Fans don’t want to watch detailed videos of their QB shitting the bed. So if dudes have good games, he goes to the good. The entire point is to get people to watch.

UNC gets a new OC

No, Bryce leads a bottom 3rd offense every season…..and individual contribution is also bottom 3rd. Shough’s situation is complete trash in terms of talent around him. Folks calling the Saints more talented is the definition of how Bryce causes people to break their brains/logic defending him. and that was just an in division example as icing on the cake of much more clear cut examples of the Bryce issue. QB and OC. Thats the golden goose. That’s where we lack. Bare minimum we need to address 1 next year. Big picture, both

Yeah, I knew that’s what you are looking for. Top tier QB talent that rises all boats. Shough hasn’t proven crap but his team is crap….and 7 starts in he blowing rookie Bryce out of the water and producing more offense as a stater than year 3 Bryce does for his team. 4-3 as a starter and carrying big loads. Which is relevant to the Bryce conundrum. Bryce haters don’t actually hate Bryce. We want the Panthers fixated on building a great team. And it’s the the key O spots that get you there…..which are weak links present day

It's always something. Several of the best offenses in the NFL right now have meh skill talent around their QBs. Patriots aren't putting up crazy O because they got off an ACL Diggs and not much else. It's the QB and coaching. Josh Allen is a one man show. It's a special QB. Carolina needs a QB and an OC change. One at a bare minimum. in division, Tyler Shough isn't outproducing Bryce right now as as a starter because of skill talent. It's the playcaller and a QB that clearly fits in.

Sam is still Sam. He basically does the same thing every stop. Carolina. Minny. And now Seattle. Good starts and people think he has evolved....but Sam always comes out. He came out in Minny. Coming out now in Seattle. And people were claiming was going to be league MVP a quarter of the way through the season in Carolina.

We are 22nd in scoring %. Saying we are a ball control offense doesn't change anything. It's a low ceiling offense that doesn't produce much offense. And it's not very efficient or good w/ the opportunities it does have (22nd in scoring %) I mean, getting to 8 wins is really crazy. I mean props to Canales but that's just not a working formula going forward. When this season ends, we need our front office to really acknowledge the overachieving and sort of flukiness of this season. We got a lot of work to do still.

Just because you don’t have an abnormally healthy starting OL in a given year….doesn’t mean they are playing bad because depth gets involved We have seen lots of bad OL play in Carolina at times. This unit is not one of the bad variants we have seen run game has been top 10 most of the year. Bumped down to 11 at the moment.

Thanks. I fixed it lol

Yeah, it’s just one of those quirky season. I do sort of chalk it up to sort of that Steve Wilks respectable window. It’s not really a plan to be good. But with some help you can end up respectable.

I still think we should be rolling with Tmac, Coker and Tremayne as the base 3 WR look. Tremayne seems like the best option as the steady presence on the field. Then you keep working Horn in. Plus it’s the best big picture move as well I would have made XL inactive weeks ago. Renfrow would have been better active for last several weeks as the last body. Moore is fine as well going forward but I do worry he its Moore, Canales will just let his boy take Tremayne/Horn’s work which he shouldn’t