CRA

You do realize that these bankruptcy proceedings generally don’t pay everyone all that they are owed? some is better than none though. But yeah, people most likely get screwed.

Nothing on the football front. but if you like concerts there is that and if you like soccer he brought that here. so he has brought some new entertainment opportunities to the community.

Well as I said earlier, my brother in law is the massive Giants fan. I get a lot of my insight from the fact he consumes it all. And you basically admit to just googling numbers and not actually watching them to form your narrative. Numbers lie all the time in sports. So I’m siding with the Giants fan’s perspective on this one. And he had a field day laughing at me when our rockstar OC move was Ben McAdoo. I mean no one was talking about a great OC sitting out there year after year somehow being overlooked again and again. He interviewed with all sorts of bad teams that needed a competent OC year after year….yet no one wanted him. The NFL also backs my Giant fan brother in laws views on McAdoo. now suddenly hanging by a thread Rhule pulls him out of the pile….he is hidden stud OC that demands praise and excitement. so if he shouldn’t be viewed as a low end OC (bottom 3rd) based on your research. Where should a sensible person rank our OC. That’s you. Not me. Tell me that, I told you where I got them ranked. I think Rhule, McAdoo, Snow all rank in the bottom 3rd. And I treat them as such. You are against it. So instead of being against my thoughts just tell me where I should view McAdoo. Top half? Middle? Top 10. I mean better than Joe Brady is already a position I own.

Didn’t say it was McAdoo’s fault the team sucked overall and only won 6 games in each of those 2 seasons. But it’s still relevant. if you suck and have the offense open for all 4 quarters….it can lead to inflated offensive stats. So you don’t want to talk about all 4 years. Now you want to rule out 2014 too? You only broke down 2015. And final score ending within a score also doesn’t tell the whole picture. You would need to breakdown the late scores that brought it within a score. Because that’s how you get inflated offense. Being wide open for 4 quarters while other teams are sitting on the win. For example, Panthers were up 21 going into the 4th q. Washington up 17 going to to the 4th in 2015. Those were some of your close losses you referenced on that lone season. * you cut it out of the quote. But was Mike Shula an excellent OC in 2015? Because he had the #1 scoring O in the NFL? I don’t think he was excellent. So I don’t just use a ranking and let it carry all the weight on an OC. I don’t think McAdoo was great. Shula most definitely wasn’t.

how do you know that. Tepper and company have been asked about that allegation and have refused to comment. I believe that still holds true to date. So how do you know it isn’t true if Tepper is unwilling to comment when specifically asked?

I mean, you sort of answered the question. he is the owner of the Carolina Panthers. So, looking to twist up small time RH in some poo deal….doesn’t seem like the ideal move if you don’t want to look bad in your community. And whatever you think of SC….that’s his market/community. Especially one that is essentially a Charlotte suburb as this point.

That’s always been my gut feeling. Tepper essentially admitted and came into the NFL immediately believing X, Y and Z were what needed to be done. Then time showed he was wrong on some of those beliefs. I think the RH project is an example of that. Time went on and it looked dumber and dumber to him.

He was the playcaller for 4 seasons in NY. That’s factual. I use all 4 years as a playcaller to judge his playcalling ability. Ben McAdoo has been searching for an OC job for years and years since NY. And only bumbling Matt Rhule would finally bring him in. And Rhule probably is considered the weakest HC in the NFL right now. Or one of them if you want to be generous. If you want to argue Ben McAdoo isn’t a bottom 3rd OC? Have it. I’m not going to go searching for proof that Rhule, McAdoo and Snow wouldn’t fall into the bottom 3rd vs their peers when looking at all 32 teams. It’s subjective. You can’t prove he isn’t. That’s subjective too. How did you view Mike Shula in 2015? Would you call him excellent just because the Panthers had the #1 scoring O in all the NFL? I wouldn’t. Seems like that is your argument for McAdoo. And I call McAdoo’s pure OC years good. The team sucked. They had some inflated offensive numbers IMO because Eli (2 time Super Bowl champion) got to air it out for 4 straight quarters all season in losing efforts.

I find it hard to believe anyone in RH actually believed they could get the draft. Seems more like something a politician would be be using to dupe people that don’t know the NFL.

If Ron Rivera hadn't been hired to be Washigton's HC.....he would have easily found a job as DC. He wouldn't of spent years looking for a DC role if he wanted one.

I’m simply looking at the 4 years he was a playcaller. I judge him off his collective body of work. and based on the fact no one has hired him until Matt Rhule did….I think is evidence the rest of the league is looking the bad years too. I don’t think good and horrible as that hyperbolic. I mean hyperbolic is kind part of message board posting. So there is always some of that in it. But the playcalling as HC is largely what got him fired. No scapegoat existed for him. Which is just a dumb move if you are young NFL coach. need someone to blame for your early blunders. I really don't care. Mike Shula wasn't a good OC. It wasn't said a lot because people weren't acting like he was some great hire. I just don't get how it is controversal to not be exited about Ben McAdoo. I keep hearing about this great staff. I think there are some great parts to it but the HC/OC/DC are all weak by league standards IMO.

2 good + 2 horrible = what? I'm not dismissing anything. I simply am bringing into the equation what some don't want brought up. I talked about Coughlin likely being ONE of the factors that went into his playcalling going off the rails. But you basically can't mention anything without people going overboard on it. I also acknowledged some others too like the fact he probably didn't have the makeup to be a HC yet, the brutal NY press that might of been a little to harsh, etc. But now I am Coughlin super fan lol. Well, McAdoo tried to get OC jobs for the 2019, 2020, 2021 and finally the 2022 season. Only the great Matt Rhule finally came calling in 2022. I mean, that alone should tell you that league itself isn't willing to just isolate those 2 years in a vaccum in terms of him as a playcaller/OC. He would have found a job as an OC before Rhule finally took him in.

Again, he called offensive plays for the Giants for 4 seasons. You deem 2 of them off limits simply because they were horrible years. if you want to have an honest discussion then the complete resume matters. And I would assume the complete resume had a lot to do with what he failed to find an OC job despite looking for one the last 3 years. And hot seat disaster Matt Rhule happened to be the only gig he could finally get. wish him the best. But the narrative McAdoo is good just isn’t one people should be expected to agree with. If he was good, he would have been hired in 2019 or 2020 or 2021. Good OCs get hired to be OCs when they want the job. So the league obviously agrees he isn’t this hotshot prize. Or I guess you can argue Matt Rhule is just smarter than the rest of the league

We hired him to call plays. He called plays over the course of 4 seasons. I talk about all 4. you only want 2 talked about. Because the other two he received brutal criticism for.

Coughlin was simply old school from a different era than the modern day NFL O. But overtly predictable playcalls weren't actually his knock. People called Shula in Carolina overtly simple. He really wasn't. It was just boring to watch. Again, I just don't see the fixation of trying to hype McAdoo into some great hire. He isn't a great hire. Better than Joe Brady isn't much of a bar. We have a bottom 1/3 OC and DC IMO. Same w/ the HC. Yet people are calling this a great staff. It's a better staff. It's still subpar.

McAdoo's first OC job was under a long time and stable offensive oriented HC. I'm pretty sure that HC was pretty involved. Why wouldn't an expeirenced offensive HC be fairly involved with a brand spanking new OC debuting. And McAdoo's playcalling looked pretty bad in year 3 and 4 without that supervision/oversight. I mean, that isn't a radical view. That Coughlin likely was a factor in why McAdoo's playcalling took such a drastic nosedive. Not dimissing him taking on too much but most answers are complex and involve a multitude of reasons that factor. and Coughlin's teams overall were pretty consistent in the NFL. And overly simplistic playcalls weren't the signature. That's was when McAdoo had no supervision. *and those Coughlin teams at the end likely had inflated offensive stats because they lost so many games. They never won more than 6 when McAdoo arrived to be OC and were always in catchup mode. So those are numbers are going to jive up exactly with a lot of his prior teams that didn't lose.

I mean Teddy was speaking truths though. Wasn’t probably the best look for our staff.

I really think Minshew might be the QB to look at in regards to McAdoo when thinking about Corral. Really the only guy McAdoo got his hands on. I mean McAdoo worked with 2 time Super Bowl champ and 1 time Super Bowl GOAT Rodgers after their rings. Not sure that means much. Ron Rivera could be Aaron Rodgers’ QB coach.

Tabor I think was the best hire. Really surprised more didn’t pursue him. Maybe Wilks though given we are getting that caliber of coach in the role he took on. I don’t think we would no what to do as fans if we actually saw great special teams. Been so rare the last couple decades here. I still remember getting hype Mark Jones could return kicks by basically, not fumbling, just running straight at a reasonable speed lol

David Tepper said Sam Darnold was a very good QB. Would it be reasonable to assume he actually believes that? Or most likely just saying what he has to say to the media?

Cool. And I don’t care that you have told me that repeatedly in our conversations. It’s going to come up. Probably a lot. Until he is gone. Now just apply the same concept elsewhere

I mean it’s a Panther message board. Gonna be hard to a lot of Panther football conversations…if you constantly demand folks not bring up certain things/topics/points. I mean pick something. Sam Darnold. You can’t demand it no longer get brought up as long as he is QB1 on our depth chart. It’s just going to happen.

I mean it’s just a fact he was a horrible playcaller when he was the HC in NY. That’s not schtick. Calling water wet is a problem for you. That’s clear. Feel free to ignore it. I mean, I have said Joe Brady should of never been hired here and maybe a select few teams could of tried to that type experiment. But very few really had the environment for that type gamble. You call me a Joe Brady super fan because you don’t want to acknowledge what a bad architect Matt Rhule was for his offense. And it’s him we should be talking about. And Matt Rhule is always the context of Joe Brady being relevant to a conversation. If McAdoo has success I’ll be happy to give him props. But people are reinventing him IMO into some great hire that people are suppose to be giddy about. We have a cast people demand people be happy about. Tepper, Rhule….even the McAdoo types have to earn it at this stage IMO. No one would touch McAdoo as OC for years. Bumbling Matt Rhule finally would. That’s probably a red flag in itself.

I brought up Coughlin because he was a long time and stable coach in the NFL. Giants didn’t have a losing season from 2005 to 2012 under him. Had 4 straight winning seasons in freaking Jacksonville. Coughlin is flawed and not great. Stable? Yes. And an offensive guy. Was exploring variables in regards to the Giants as to why he was brought up the narrative in the Giants overly predictable playcalling only appeared when McAdoo had no boss. I’m sure it wasn’t just one thing that lead to it getting so bad.