CRA

Well, that’s the difference. Those are roleplayers. Luck and Ben had those types too…..in addition to pro bowl/all pro talent and them. Im not bashing our guys. But those aren’t they type that will bail a rookie out and do it on their own

I mean Payton Manning sat out. They played some undrafted kid if I recall the year prior to Luck's arrival. No one is saying a HOF caliber WR can make a horrible QB good. Rookie QBs that contend generally have elite D or great skill talent to mask the growing pains. Luck is an example of it. So was Ben. But yeah, part of Luck's rookie success was being able to throw nearly 200 times at an All Pro/Pro Bowl WR that will go to the HOF......and aided his overall development his first couple seasons. Whose Bryce's playmaker?

Luck had a HOF caliber WR when he walked in the door. Who was an already established All Pro/Pro Bowl WR. and Luck targeted Wayne a mind boggling 194 times his rookie season.

The Steelers had the #1 D in the NFL his rookie season. Multiple Pro Bowlers on offense. Which again, is how you can make it work.

Not sure about that. On paper, Ron's teams were better. so you are really only looking at the Rhule era. And I guess it depends on how weight you put in legit studs like CMC, DJ Moore, etc. This team is stud less at the moment on O. We have a much better staff than the Rhule era.

Name a team? That didn't have an established top tier D or HOF skill talent that inserted a rookie QB and was instantly able to contend? Rebuilds take time. QBs have to develop. To contend with a rookie, you largely need a roster that can make up for the fact you got a rookie QB.

I don't think Fields is terrible. You need talent in the NFL. Especially young guys. Fields hasn't had that in the pass game. I'd say it's safe money his pass #'s are drastically better this year. And that's because DJ Moore can make plays. People were calling Trevor a bust his rookie year. It wasn't just Urban. He had no WRs. They couldn't get open. Steve Smith could get open with me calling the plays. NFL is a talent driven league. Josh Allen was meh. Then they added Diggs. Then he put up MVP numbers.

and odds are simply the Panthers SOS as a whole will be tougher than last year. Think we finished with the 30th easiest schedule last year. I think the NFCS is going to be better this year. How much? Don't know. Safe bet is it being better.

Jets were running generic stuff too…..and didn’t play a lot of their studs. we got abused in a game basics.

LOL No one is overrating Teddy. He was a game manager. But it’s silly to think a rookie walks on the field week 1 and is the consistent game manager type that a veteran, experienced and good game manager was. Bryce has a ton to learn and it takes times. Expect higher highs and lower lows than Teddy. People are equating what we think Bryce will be for in the future with what the will be this season. That’s not how the rookie QB thing works.

Well, they have to get Bryce ready. So yeah, they aren’t able to develop him in camp like the dude. But he can work all season.

He did. But Teddy was also experienced. Again, 40+ games, playoff experience, pro bowl, played under a GOAT. I would think expecting him to be at Teddy’s steadiness out the gate is a bit much for Bryce. He could have higher highs but a rookie is going to have lows. And part of the reason Teddy was so critical of Rhule was his experiences

Corral hasn’t been through one preseason yet. He is cheap and young. I don’t want to cut him. Just keep developing him. In each of the last 5 years Dalton has taken the field for a team he has had a losing record. This will be his 13th year. He isn’t an answer to our backup spot for Bryce. Just a rental.

Prior to that Bridgewater caliber performance….he played in 44 games, made a pro bowl, made the postseason, played with a GOAT, etc. I don’t think that’s fair to Bryce to think at a minimum he should be Teddy out of the gate.

I mean, it is a rebuild. Nothing wrong with that. Excited about this one. It just sucks we wasted years with Rhule having us in no man’s land. Maybe they can get it off the ground and rolling quick. But I’m going to be patient with it.

Meh. That’s just coaching talk. we are 100% a rebuild. Saying we aren’t is just making up a new definition. NFL rookie QBs are NFL rookie QBs. Lot of history to go off of. Winning is hard. Even for the good ones. And we don’t have the roster that proven to be needed to make up the difference to get them over those learning curves. This is about developing Young into a good QB. And maybe the division is such utter trash a bad team gets in. But that still wouldn’t make us good or playoff caliber.

Your entire premise is based on being able to be “one game away” from postseason play this year if we were just as bad as last season. And then you add upgrades and then add more wins. Which isn’t how you can/should look at it. New season. No clue who are the tough and bad teams. People stamping in Saints and Falcons as trash and fact. Other aspects too. Can’t do that. NFL history says you cant. this year we have a rookie QB. New O. New D, New HC. That has never been a formula for a team to look good. Winning is hard and I imagine it will be for this team. again, see Cam in 2011. Winning is hard. For rookies and new teams.

I’m acknowledging the actual play and opponents…..and not just the win. again, to think we can win games scoring 10 points and a QB throwing for 40 yards this year vs the Saints as realistic?? we played crap teams and when we when stepped on the field vs a good team last year we got brutally stomped. we weren’t good under Wilks. We would play bad conservative football and it would allow us to compete vs bad teams that couldn’t stop the run. But good football is not what we did last year.

First year Cam and Delhomme had better talent around them than Bryce Young will this year. Talent matters. Bryce has the weakest talent around him

I like Wilks. Got no beef with Wilks. I think the players liked him. BUT we weren’t a good football team under him. We just happened to play a lot of teams that were amongst the worst in stopping the run or had horrific QBs. When we played an actual playoff team we got smashed. Early and hard. Wasn’t even competitive for a quarter. And that has nothing to do with Wilks being bad. He didn’t have the talent to actually have a good football team and the 2022 Panthers weren’t a good team under him.

You largely knew it before the game….when traded away all our offensive studs for the draft, hired a new staff, that has a new O, new D and has a rookie QB.

If you had one of the top 10 worst run Ds in the NFL or horrific QB play….the Wilks Panthers might could get you. We weren’t good.

But that season was its own thing. And Steve Wilks didn’t actually have us playing good football. It just wasn’t Matt Rhule, We weren’t a good team. It was a messed up season full of bad opponents where you could come compete in a game despite literally not passing to the extent it looked like he was trying to sabotage the team (first game) to winning with your starting QB finishing with 40 pass yards and putting up 10 points (last game) and we are rebuilding. Traded away all our offensive stars. We have a rookie QB. Brand new offense. Brand new defense. Brand new staff. That’s a rebuild. Regardless what Frank says.

But you can’t base everything on last years record. It will be a new season. Every team and season is different. The 2011 squad was significantly better on O around the QB than what we have this year. Yet you paint us a better positioned. And Cam brought insane offensive volume. winning is hard for rookies. For teams with new coaches and all new schemes. and how are the Saints and Falcons worse?

I think Young can be the dude….but yeah, it will take years to acquire the right cast for him and frankly he needs his own offensive scheme tailored to him. Which I think we can do. But the expectations on Young this year are bonkers. we don’t have the skill talent and scheme remains to be scene for Bryce to thrive. Unsure what Frank is going to do there until the season starts. But Frank got bounced in Indy because of O and not getting it done. He seems more like a fit what I do sort of coach to date