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well, I will continue to hope that either Shenault proves capable of an expanded role and if not, they add a quality guy for that role in our backfield when cuts happen. Preferably the latter as Young's health and growth are frankly the only thing I care about in 2023.

I don't claim they rated him him poorly as receiver among RBs. They did. They have multiple times. logically, for a lot of the same reasons Philly steadily took him out of that role after his rookie season. Which was documented along the way. His struggles post rookie season in that role.

Well, I didn't start there. I started sharing some of the talk out of Philly that you somehow couldn't find on the ole google machine. You countered by sharing people praising his rushing. people around here love PFF stats every week after a game. I largely use it for fantasy and it's flawed. But yeah, generally when they say you are worst in the NFL at something......it's a stretch to claim they are actually solid at it. For example, I doubt you could find any player using PFF stats that ranked #1 or dead last in their rankings on something and argue in reality that they are actually good/bad at that. I mean, Miles Sandes excluded. Because that apparently is what you are going with now. It's interesting, so it's cool to critique an area of Hubbard's game. But not Miles.

when you pull up the RBs the list actually includes 2 FBs in the overall listing. Probably some glitch pulling them in as they are supposed to filter out. 149 was FB Adam Prentice. I mean, PFF is what it is. Like I said, love it or hate. They are mixing in all sorts of things into their grade evaluations besides just a math tally of credited stats. So two players with identical credited stats aren't going to grade the same. I think they should add a solid vet in cuts that has proven to be really good in that role. I mean, that largely remains my point. Which is why I alluded to all the Shenault talk they keep up with. They simply may be giving him a real shot to prove he can do more in the backfield. That would be the spot. But him being forced into protection would be the issue/unproven realm with him.

Good rusher. That's what he is. He gets credit for that. We needed one. Dude has holes in his game. Bryce Young is what matters. Matters why more than the annual over the top hype train game. We need more in our backfield than Sanders and Hubbard. That's not controversial.

lol. I mean, PFF is just one thing. That said he was horrific at that job. You can ignore that. You can ignore what the Eagles did with him. You can ignore all the consistent reporting on Sanders' game and what he is good and bad at. Chubba had a better drop % than Sanders last year. Guess Hubbard is Marshall Faulk now.

Just to be clear, I'm not upset about his pay. I just think the smart thing to do for Bryce Young is to give him a more well-rounded committee. We lack a proven and good 3rd down option type for the rookie. That's what a good committee should be. Diverse. A small rookie QB should have proven guys too. for some reason some are fixated that Miles Sanders should basically be a poor mans CMC and play every down.

graded the 147th RB out of 148 by PFF as a receiver in 2022 by PFF graded 110th RB out of 140 by PFF as a pass blocker in 2022 by PFF I mean, that is why he isn't an Eagle and Swift is. But yeah, a really good team deemed him not fit for that 3rd down role so it would make sense for us to do it with our rookie QB. my hope is they are letting Shenault essentially audition for that 3rd down role first. Because he can do the pure receiving aspect of Bryce getting it out hot. Lot of consistent talk about wanting him to be a lot more than be a gadget backfield guy. Not super cool with a guy just learning to pass pro in the backfield protecting Bryce though if him auditioning for that is the plan.

So let's take PFF grade last year on Miles Sanders as a receiving option amongst RBs in 2022. 148 out of 149 RBs graded. I mean, even if you don't love PFF. They get in the ballpark of things. And they didn't just deem him not effective. They deemed him really bad in both 2022 and 2020 in the receiving game. Miles Sanders is a natural rusher. Not pass catcher. The fixation on him needing to be THE DUDE every down here just isn't something I can get down with based on his last 3 years. I mean, a featured RB isn't something I want to begin with. Very few fit that mold in reality. A really good NFL team just told you he isn't that dude. Committees don't just make sense financially....they also generally make sense in being effective. He is a weak receiving option w/ a history of meh pass pro. Solid rusher. He has a place here. I don't dislike him. Bryce Young deserves more IMO.

he had a breakout year as a rusher. Which I acknowledge is a strength and glad he is here to do. And that's the role the Eagles used him in. The discussion is about the Panthers not having a well-rounded committee and a strong back for the rookie in passing scenarios. Miles Sanders and Chubba Hubbard are not receiving backs. And they especially aren't good RBs in that department when you factor in having a rookie QB that is going to need to be getting rid of it quick. Take someone else's take.... 2022 PFF receiving grades for all RBs CMC - 1 out of 149 Miles Sanders - 148 out of 149 I'm glad you listen to beat writers. Go listen to all the Philly writers who have documented and discussed why Sanders was used less and less in the receiving game as his career went on. There are reasons that aren't a secret in regards to the WHY he was utilized less and less in the passing game. Reasons why the Eagles leaned on Gainwell over Sanders overall in the postseason too. Philly writers that covered him for 4 years. Maybe check there thoughts out too.

2022+2021+2020 outweigh 2019. After a promising rookie season he disappointed as a pass catcher and the Eagles phased him out of that role. That’s the Sanders story in Philly. and now you somehow quote someone praising his 2022 rushing ability as some type of argument that he is a good pass catching RB? Wut???! I’ve praised his rushing ability in this convo. That’s all that first bit you shared did. We talking passing down help for Young. Second chunk. Yeah, the Eagles had a committee. And they inserted RBs into situations that played to their strengths. Eagles are a good team. Which was rushing for Miles. It’s why it talks about COMPLIMENTING Miles with an exciting dual threat RB. again last 3 years, no one would define Sanders and Hubbard as passing down RBs. We got a rookie QB that is going to need to get it out quick. That’s not Sanders’ natural gig and we have seen that the last several years. We should round out the backfield by getting someone proven to be good in pass pro and receiving. Bryce Young’s development matters most. Get someone that actual has proven they can do the job well. 2023 should be about Bryce Young. Not avoiding an easy add and betting Miles can somehow be someone the Eagles said he wasn’t.

Sanders had clear cut issues in 2020 and was bad in the pass game. It is well documented. That’s not debatable. They carried over into 2021 training camp. Well documented. Not really debatable. 2021 the Eagles began giving passing down work to other RBs that are better suited for the job. Even Miles Sanders himself acknowledged the skill differences and work going away from him. Same documented struggles in 2022 camp in the passing game. Eagles faded him in passing downs again that season. Big time in the postseason. You are ignoring to fit your narrative. Miles Sanders is a rusher. That’s what he has been. That’s what a really good team found him to be. That’s who we signed. again, we need to add to our committee. Miles Sanders doesn’t need to be treated as the do everything RB. He wasn’t that in Philly. Shouldn’t be here. Bryce Young should be the focus. And he needs a quality passing down RB in the mix. This hot take is about as wild as calling Matt Rhule trash about this same time last year. I don’t intentionally stir poo up. But I’m going to talk about Matt Rhule or Miles Sanders or whoever the same no matter the uniform if the Falcons or the Panthers suddenly added them to the roster. I’ve never been part of the preseason hype squad where only the good daydream is acceptable talk. In recent years, no one consider Sanders or Hubbard good passing down RBs. That’s not controversial. Hope both turn into them. But I’d rather add to the committee because Bryce Young and his development is more important. I’ve not knocked Sanders the runner. Glad he is here. That’s what he did well in Philly.

Sanders is the league leader among running backs in dropped passes with 8 on the season. Miles Sanders says he hasn’t been the best in the passing game (usatoday.com) “He’ll be the first to tell you, is his hands,” said Staley. “Miles will tell you we go over that. We throw balls, we catch a lot of balls, we talk it through, and we watch every route. We’re constantly trying to get better. But he’ll be the first to tell you that he has to tighten his hands up.” Miles Sanders says he hasn’t been the best in the passing game (usatoday.com) According to Eliot Shorr-Parks, Philadelphia Eagles running back Miles Sanders has struggled with ball security and drops during training camp. 'Ball security and drops an issue' for Miles Sanders during Philadelphia's camp (numberfire.com) Is Kenny Gainwell replacing Miles Sanders as Eagles’ lead running back? – NBC Sports Philadelphia Even Sanders has said Gainwell is a more natural pass catcher than he is. But it’s hard to ignore the sense that the Eagles feel that Gainwell, with his speed, elusiveness and receiving ability, is just a better fit for this offense than Sanders, who’s a holdover from the Doug Pederson days. I mean, talk to a Philly fan. Not sure why people don't want more diversity the backfield given we are starting a rookie QB who we don't want hit.

what's in dispute you want evidence of? that he lead the NFL in drops and drop % by NFL RBs in 2020? Tied w/ Zeke in drops but a much higher drop %? that Duce talked about his hands? That the coaches talked about the routes and balls he struggled with after NFL defenses got a look at him following his rookie year? that he continued to struggle the next year in camp as a pass catcher and wasn't reliable in pass situations going forward into the following season? that Eagles clearly turned to other RBs in clear passing scenarios as his career in Philly progressed? that Miles was open about how others just flat out had better hands and were more natural catchers and why they made sense being inserted over him? Miles Sanders is a good runner. Glad to have him. That's what we had to add. My argument is only now we need to a RB to the backfield that excels as a pass catcher and in pass pro. Given what we are in 2023. Because to date, that has not been Sanders or Hubbard. CMC is gone. And developing and protecting Bryce Young should be priority #1. That's what I care about. Bryce Young. Not overstating what a FA RB add has been. Add a RB and I got zero beef w/ the backfield. But it's incomplete.

he should play. as much as any other starter. we got a new scheme. Horn hasn't even logged a season yet in the NFL. We need to be good defensively this year. I don't want to go w/ a Mr. Glass mindset. Also sets a bad tone I think w/ other legit starters. Horn more precious than Burns or Brown?

I mean, most players aren't CMC. Coaches still want and need players that aren't that. That's how you build teams. Saying Miles Sanders is a solid runner and hasn't been a good receiving RB isn't calling Miles Sanders trash that shouldn't be on the team. I think we should round out our backfield given the recent history of Miles and Chubba. Everything should be about Bryce Young. And the past several years would at least say we don't have as well rounded of a group as we should given how quick we should be getting the ball out. I don't view that as wild. I mean, all it takes is a quick google and you can find tons of reporting in Philly about Sanders and his struggles post rookie season in the pass game. And how it opened the door for others to come in on passing downs. Duce, head coach, and even Sanders himself acknowledging others were just better.

I actually don't disagree that if Wilks had this team earlier we would have won more games. But I think that is largely the competition we drew that year. We were competing while not exactly doing what I call playing great NFL football. Which I mean, it could happen again. Schedules to an extent make teams. Good teams largely have weak schedules. Best teams last year did. Really bad ones, tough schedules. And the prediction on SOS more times than not is hard to predict.

I mean, that is an article from early in his second season. If context matters, you can't just reference the take a month into his sophomore season. He went on that season to lead all RBs in dropped passes and highest drop rate. You can find articles with Duce and everyone talking about his bad routes, bad hands, etc that extend well past a month into year 2. Problems continued the next year in camp. Seasons after. Lack of reliability. And Philly continued to insert more reliable options into passing downs year after year. Miles Sanders is not a 3 down RB for a team starting a rookie QB IMO. We need to add a RB to our backfield. I mean, you can hope he improves. I do too. But the fact is, he hasn't been a good pass catcher in Philly. They didn't view it that way. And we don't view Hubbard as that. So why wouldn't we add a RB that actually has proven to be able to be good at what we know we will need to be a big part of our O. Instead of just hoping Miles turns into rookie Miles just because we want/need that.

Miles Sandes isn't a good pass catcher. It's largely why he found his way out in Philly. After his rookie season, he began to have big issues in the pass game. It's pretty well documented. Really bad sophomore season as a pass catcher. Plagued him in camps after that. Philly never trusted him again really in that role. Which is why they consistently pulled him in those scenarios going forward in favor of RBs more reliable. We know Hubbard isn't that dude. We have early down runners. Which is fine. Just hope they end up rounding out the backfield before the season starts. We have a skill hole in our backfield IMO. Especially given Young is going to have to unload it quick and often this upcoming season.

I'd love him coming off the bench if needed. But I suspect he might could get a starting gig for a team in need.

teams are going to load the box and force the pass. We got a stable of RBs with bad hands. We have a very average receiving cast compared to the rest of the league. Good coaches or not, you got to have talent that can win in the situations you get put in. I just expect a rockier road than some here. I love the Bryce pick. I just think expectations for this year are coming in pretty dang high for a rookie QB who will be in an offense that is new to everyone involved. Every aspect is a brand new marriage. The Panthers would basically have to be an anomaly of sorts to have real success with the way we are entering this season. And the general consensus here is playoffs. That seems high. An unneeded expectations for Young. Just seems to be a predictable path, going to end up having folks end up bashing Bryce for being a standard rookie going through rookie things. I just care about growth from Bryce. I care about that more than wins in 2023.

That doesn’t seem to be fair math for Bryce Young. Cam had a STUD cast around him offensively as a rookie and getting to 7 is a lot different than getting to 11. we got to 7 wins last year by winning a game where we had 32 passing yards on the day and scored 10 points. Our schedule should be tougher this year. Saints and Falcons should be better.

I mean in fairness, we won a game last year with 32 passing yards. I think overall the division will be slightly better overall than last year. So I think our schedule might be harder. plus, just the rookie QBs factor and winning games being hard in the NFL. Learning how to win and all. I suspect we could actually look like the better team sometimes and just struggle putting it all together at the end. People seemed to have removed Bryce Young from going through rookie struggles and learning. I think the 6 to 9 win range is probable. Lot depends on just the randomness of NFL games and how the ball bounces. Don’t think we will be good enough offensively to overcome things when they don’t go our way.

Duce was also there when the ball got taken out of his hands though as a pass catcher. Sanders isn’t in Philly because he lacked the ability to be a reliable dual threat player. I think he is a fine rusher. Hubbard is that too. A reliable pass catcher? IMO, we don’t have that. And we are trotting out a rookie QB who needs that. Hope they add some savvy 3rd down bet to add that component for Young.

Freak defenses or hall of fame skill position talent generally have been the markings of how teams made the playoffs with rookie QBs.