Stumpy

Did Mrazek even try there?

Slavvin looks a hell of a lot more deserving of $8m/yr than Dougie atm.

Jeez Mrazek was lucky as hell to get a skate to that one.

fug

I'd definitely add Burns to that list. JJ Jansen probably has apretty good argument... lol But, to me that speaks to the overall paucity of talent on our team at the moment. Statistically, with the number of positions and teams, each team should have 6 or 7 any given year. I just don't want to end up in another Shaq Thompson situation. Stuck paying an above average player top 5 money because we're mismanaged contracts on a bad team.

LMAO... Brian Burns led the NFC in fan voting for best edge rusher while splitting time between 2 different positions in only his second year in the league. DJ Moore was voted most likely to hit 76 yds in the air and 1.5 on the ground per game going into his contract year. Surely, you can see the difference.

If he puts up 3000+ yards and 25ish TDs while learning to stay calm and take what the defense gives you when plays break down, I'd be ecstatic.

Still so wierd seeing it written out. I thought it was a typo at first.

There are tiers of receivers, I think we're can all agree on that. - HOFers: 2 or 3 at any given time - All Pros: maybe 5 or 10 - Pro Bowlers: 10-15 with opt outs - X Receivers: 32 - Starters: ~80 in a pass happy NFL - JAGs: 200 or so - Camp Fodder: probably 1000 Some fans on here act like DJ is tier 1 or 2 despite never earning a single All Pro vote. With the moves the team has made, Moore is poised to be paid in the 2-3 range. His stats show he is somewhere between tier 3 and 4. And his lack of Pro Bowl honors backs that up. Anyone who points that out is apparently putting him in tier 6 or 7 with most of the rest of the WRs the Panthers have drafted in franchise history.

@jdr6000?

Alright dude, I believe you. You were clearly the only person I could've seen post one of the 2 original stats. Spare me the network forensics. Moving on to your next point, you're right. I typed starter when in my head I was thinking a teams top WR. I should've said X Receiver. I do consider Moore a top tier starting NFL receiver. But, as a number one guy (which is the role he has had since the day he was drafted) he leaves something to be desired. I don't see teams gameplanning to take him away, or rolling coverages his way when they don't. Maybe we just have different definitions of elite. I would have a hard time calling any WR who gets beat out by a TE in a 16 game season elite.

So should Frank Gore (who was never thought of as a top 5 RB in the league) be considered on the same level as Adrian Peterson who dominated the league for a time period?

That is exactly my point! Except add Jones, Diggs, Hopkins and Jefferson.

I wasn't trying to call out anyone in particular. This has been going around for months on Facebook/Reddit/Twitter/Huddle/etc There were 2 different stats that both have been floating around. He was the only WR with 1200 from scrimmage both years and the only WR with 1175 receiving yards both years. IDK which came out first, but both only serve to prove that he is middle of the road for starting receivers. 1200 yards for a WR is good for about 10-15 in the league every year for the past 2 decades.

I don't think next year's 2nd sends the message that we are all in. Also, having 2 talented young QBs competing with each other for the starting job would be a godsend. WTF tried it years ago, and had Shanahan not completely fuged it up they would have been sitting pretty. If you go to Cousins instead of forcing RG3 to gut out some rough injuries, you have your franchise QB and a kings ransome. Either Griffin heals up and learns on the bench and is better in the long run, or you are the only ones who know how bad it is and you can keep Kirk and trade Bob.

Then why did Samuel and McCaffery improve every year as pass catchers with the same QBs as Moore? And Robby demonstrably improved with Teddy, Sammy and PJ Washington.

All of this can be true at the same time. I agree on the talent. The issue it's here has shown no ability/desire to reach his ceiling at this point in his career. He is largely the same player we drafted. As for middle of the road, if you consider the top 32 WRs "starters" he finished in the 2nd quartile and closer to 32 than to 1 in yardage both years.

Michael Thomas had the ghost of Drew Brees and Teddy Bridgewater over the same span. Amari Cooper had Andy Dalton and some dude who nobody knows. Diggs & Hopkins changed QBs too, although I'll grant their QBs were better.

So on top of being a middle of the road starting reciever, he adds 1.5 rushing yards per game too?

So if you make it 1175 AND exclude TE's, then it is technically true. So, what? What does that tell us? His 2 year average puts him 5th among WRs. But 1 of only 2 in the top 10 to play all 32 games. The other? Allen Robinson. That's his comparison. His per game average over the past 2 seasons puts him somewhere in the teens. Right around... Allen Robinson.

This... Also this...

Justin Jefferson would like to speak to you.

I won't go that far. I just think, between Cam/Allen/Teddy haters, there's been an effort to make our weapons seem better than they were. Which is weird, because the were pretty effing good already. I do wish we would've signed Samuel long term (for less than it will cost for DJ) and let Robbie and DJ fight for a contract this year a la Morgan/Witherspoon back in the day

No, and that's the point. DJ is a very good reciever, but let's stop making him out to be something he is not.

I don't know where this idea came from. But, I've seen it parroted here by different posters for months now. Unless I am crazy, this is patently false. 2019 Top 20 yardage leaders 2020 Top 20 yardage leaders 7 Players w/ 1100+ yds both years S Diggs - 1535 + 1130 = 2665 T Kelce - 1416 + 1229 = 2645 D Hopkins - 1407 + 1165 = 2572 A Robinson II - 1250 + 1147 = 2397 DJ Moore - 1175 + 1193 = 2368 D Waller - 1196 + 1145 = 2341 A Cooper - 1114 + 1189 = 2303 So, DJ Moore is a top 5 receiver over the past 2 years? Eh, not so much. Between injuries and Covid, many players didn't play a full 32 games the past 2 years. Edelmen opted out completely, though I'd imagine his stats would be pretty close to DJ's. J Jones - 1394 + 773 = 2167 (in 24 games M Thomas - 1725 + 438 = 2163 (in 23 games D Adams - 1374 + 997 = 2371 (in 26games And the guy picked side by side with DJ in the draft... C Ridley - 1374 + 866 = 2240 (in 28 games You could argue that availiblity is the most important ability. But, outside of Julio, none of these guys have injury prone histories. And I don't think any rational person would argue that DJ>JJ at this point. Yet, despite being hobbled by injuries, all 4 out performed Moore when they were on the field. Then you have young guys like Jefferson and Metcalf whose stats project out much better over time. They may not reach their ceilings, but they have already done more with their time in the league than DJ did. All of this is to say, 1. Stop saying dumb poo that is demonstrably untrue. 2. DJ Moore is not a top 5 receiver in the NFL. He is borderline top 10. 3. DJ is much closer to the Coopers/Allens/Locketts than he is to the Jones/Hopkins/Diggs of the world.