kungfoodude

It's actually fairly impressive that Alabama and Georgia are as successful as they are without any real NFL QB talent. 

I mean, I get that the rest of their roster is stacked and packed with NFL talent.

Just now, toldozer said:

Acc is better than the big 12. Duke would give tech a better game than byu is

Brother, that is simply not true.

BYU having a full meltdown.

2 minutes ago, AggieLean said:

He gone. 

I think we would really have to break the bank on him.

17 minutes ago, bandu said:

I have always liked Evero.

you give this guy some actual talent on defense & this would be one of the best defenses in the NFL 

 

Honestly, the biggest issue I have with him is that he hasn't seemed to have been a guy that elevates a defense, even going back to Denver. 

So, if I always have to assemble an elite defense to make him have elite results....is he actually a great defensive coach?

Nice chunk of high level NFL prospects in this TT/BYU game, FWIW.

4 minutes ago, mav1234 said:

The defense can't be all superstars and he's definitely stepping up. He takes bad angles sometimes but he's improved - still hope to upgrade his slot in the offseason, but he's making a solid case that we can prioritize other positions 

I think you should always endeavor to be better at every position you can. Him playing better does give you the ability to not be panicked about getting that slot filled in the offseason.

I do think we should be trying to draft his eventual replacement.

9 minutes ago, CarolinaRideorDie said:

The question is, do we resign him this offseason? 

 

And, does he want to return here after we didn't allow him to interview with the Rams?

This will actually be one of the most interesting offseason storylines for us.

18 minutes ago, Khyber53 said:

I think we'll move to the draft for pass rush guys, maybe even use our first on it. Edge rushers, especially free agents, are just too expensive. Better to grow your own.

I am not against spending top dollar for top pass rushing talent but it needs to make sense at the time. I definitely don't think Hendrickson makes ANY sense for us given age and where we are as a franchise. Phillips does make some sense as a younger guy but, again, we are in the infancy of our roster building comparatively. Why blow a ton of money on free agents every offseason? We spent a lot the last two offseasons on veteran free agents to some success but a chunk of these guys may never see the completed result of our building. 

Overall I agree. Be selective about free agents, especially in premium positions. The one big credit I will give Morgan is that he seems to be building younger. That is very smart. 

3 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

Hey, brother, I agree with you.  I am just reading tea leaves and reacting to what that might do.  I think we should be in the market until we have a top 10 QB.  Full stop.  However, since they seem hell bent on turning their hamster into a stallion, (and we have to consider Tepper's ego is in play here) I am starting from that position,  98.3% of the time, you and I are on the same page.  Seek help.

On the TE tip, that was why I was so perturbed about our decision to pass up on very good TE's several times in this past draft. This was a STACKED TE class. Guys like Fannin, Taylor, Gadsden, etc were serious needle movers(in my eyes) and they were a few of the guys that have provided instant impact, as well. 

I wasn't a big fan of the Evans pick and although he has drastically exceeded my expectations we did pass on a legit offensive weapon in Gadsden who is ehat we tried to get and largely have failed in Sanders.

Honestly, considering the early success for the 2025 class, I don't want to be too harsh but I am always annoyed that our FO never seems to take players at a position of need when the classes are very strong or definitely whiff on the better players(Evans/Etienne). It's absolutely mind boggling we keep doing it.

I am with you on upgrading at TE, though. Tremble is a fine player, I am happy to have him but he has probably come pretty close to what he is going to be. Sanders just doesn't appear to really have appreciably developed much. If he can't develop some overall consistency by the end of 2026 or make some step forward, I would classify him as largely a lost cause. Evans I have liked the potential of but he has played only 35% of the snaps on offense. I can't understand why he gets so many less snaps than a guy like Sanders. I know they are used differently but it isn't like Sanders is being targeted a ton. He has 30 targets compared to Evans 18 in WAY more snaps.

4 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

I dont doubt anything you said here.  Put as I have stated since this came up, if they pick up the 5th and thats it, then we are in uncharted waters for a top draft pick.  You can point to us picking up the 5th with darnold but thats different.  Teams normally dont navigate like this.   So they better have a damn good plan to figure this out.  

 

I would feel way more comfortable if they cut dalton, signed a dude, drafted a dude.  Do that then go from there.  Dont pick up the 5th until after the draft.  That seems logical.  But again, the fact that nobody from the press has even asked is fuging cowardly

I think ideally you make your decision early in the offseason. I say that so that we can attempt to move Bryce early while he still might have some minimal amount of value left(Rosen scenario). 

Alternatively, as you stated, see what happens in free agency and the draft, then decide to move him or not, which would likely be tied to that 5th year decision.

My take on how this ultimately goes is that we don't make a move at QB(we stay with Bryce/Dalton), we don't draft a QB and we pick up the 5th. No serious extension talks, though. I think they go partially in on Bryce but not all-in.

3 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

I bet you would be surprised at the answers if you gave the FO truth serum.  I mean for fugs sake if 85% of the huddle can see it, you mean to tell me professional football coaches and execs dont?  But as always Dave and nicole are the wild cards here.  If they want to give him an ext by God he is getting an ext and there is nothing Morgan and co can do.   Resigning in protest would be pretty funny actually

My ultimate GUESS is that the core decision makers are fairly aligned on thought process regarding Bryce. My take is that is largely dictated by the ownership and everyone else is just marching to the beat of that drum. 

I would be surprised if they are off the bandwagon yet. I think the improvements over last season for the team overall are going to drive decision making that leads us to staying committed to Bryce.

9 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

I think the best way to make Bryce better is to make everyone around him better.  This is why I advocate for a stud (top 5, eventually) TE.  I mean, when we have been a good franchise, we have had a stud TE (Walls, Olsen) and ILB (Beason, Mills, Morgan, Luke, etc) so it is in our DNA.  Expect us to address these areas this year.  (An Olsen or Walls would help Bryce a lot).  In terms of productivity, I think we are going to work with XL for one more season and ride the TMac / Coker momentum.  Where else could we find a position to improve productivity?  TE.  A position that caters to Bryce's style and shortcomings, a stud TE gives him another weapon he has not had.

The Panthers run a lot of 2-TE sets (I have seen 3) and they have a blocker (Tremble) who is great in the run game, a balanced TE (Evans), and Sanders is supposed to be the pass-catching TE. He had 340 yards last season and he has about 170 this year.  If we are going to play around with XL for another season, it only makes up to add to Bryce's weapons in a way that does not put XL on the bench, basically ending his development. It makes sense to bring in a pass-catching dawg.  The way the offense is designed, I see carrying 4, but its not ideal.

Having said that, I mentioned Oregon's Sadiq in another thread, but I am starting to warm up to Vanderbilt's Stowers and, in the Olsen/Walls mold, I kinda like Endries from Texas.  Of course, Stowers is probably going in round 2 and Endries in 3 or later.

I still say, 5 months before the draft, that I would not be surprised if we take a TE very early.

I mean, but there is ample evidence that exists currently in the NFL and historically that if you have a talented or moderately talented team then one of the biggest upgrades you can make is at QB. It yields the biggest returns.

I don't think even Prime Greg Olsen is going to make Bryce suddenly look like a stud QB. We have invested immense amounts of money on the OL and tremendous amounts of draft resources on WR's. And have added an additional extremely capable RB.

At some point, the main problem is Bryce. We are at that point. 

That being said, we don't need to go "Full Bryce" again and sell the farm to upgrade at QB. Be intelligent and patient. Try to get better by whatever means become available WHILE continuing to make the roster better. At the bare minimum, you slowly build an upper half of the NFL talented roster that is at least a potential draw for some free agent QB's.

IMO, Bryce is clearly not the answer. I don't think anyone in our organization thinks that way but if they do, it's not the end of the world. Throw as many reasonable darts as you can through free agency and the draft until either you get a bullseye or a top 10-15 option becomes available in free agency.

9 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

The Legette of this season just isn't producing.

He's definitely got the physical ability, but there are a lot of plays where he looks like he's either screwing up or just half-assing it.

Yes that's fixable, but they gotta know why it's happening and he has to be willing to make the effort to fix it. 

I think it's fairly clear he is not dedicated to being an NFL player. We don't have the time and luxury of being able to wait until his 5th year of the NFL for him to start to figure it out much like it took in college.

He is just another in a long line of Panthers WR flops. We should all be very familiar with the symptoms of that at this point.

9 hours ago, HeelsPanthersCanes said:

People have got to stop ranking these teams based on records. 

James Madison is 11-1, and if you let them play the 6 worst teams in the SEC, and the 6 worst teams in the Big 10 they'd be 0-12 and the average losing margin would be by 14+ points.

 

All you can control is the opponents in front of you.

Besides, I would rather see a regular G5 participant in the playoffs than a C-Tier P4 team that conclusively proved they couldn't win when it mattered. 

Just now, ThPantherFan said:

Probably so.  Well, they would deserve it.

Eh....not sure that but I don't think they will be realistic options.

It would be nice but unlikely.

2 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

I don't think he can because we have a ready made backup option.

DL Coach Todd Wash was on staff with Canales back in Seattle. He's got 30 years of coaching experience including five as defensive coordinator in Jacksonville.

He could also have Morgan get in touch with some of his old colleagues (Leslie Frazier among them). And of course there's likely Pete Carroll... 

Who knows the options? I am just saying Evero likely has all the leverage here.

2 hours ago, NorthTryon said:

I never said anything about Jonathan Mingo bud. You keep bringing his name up for some reason. But real quick, how's that Derrick Brown dismissal in the aforementioned timeframe working out for ya? 

About the same as your XL fanboyism is.

Get that TMJ jersey out for the next game.

1 minute ago, NorthTryon said:

I'm not going to continue to derail this man's DB appreciation thread. I'll keep hoping our players get better and you just keep dismissing them before they even play half of their first contract. I just prefer to wait a tad longer than one, one and half seasons before declaring people complete busts. 

Fair enough. I also prefer to call a player what they are.

But, I'm sure your faith in Jonathan Mingo will be rewarded in the XFL.

1 minute ago, NorthTryon said:

Wow, you really were mad about that weren't you? I just said you may be wrong. You instantly resorted to name calling and just down right nastiness. Wow, and I thought you were one of the more sensible posters here. See, I was wrong there wasn't I? I just needed to wait until we had the right difference in point of view for you to turn into a total schmuck and give a schmuck response. 

Understand, you were one of those guys. Thanks for confirming.

But, by all means, continue to be wrong about "WR's just needing more time" despite literally the past 10+ years of draft data indicating otherwise.

6 minutes ago, NorthTryon said:

Boy, you really have a hard on for this guy don't you? I was merely pointing out where the negativity and bust talk is at this point in Panthers' fandom. It is pointed at XL right now. You were wrong about DB, and you may be wrong here. But I guess you wouldn't be Shonuff if you didn't do with the confidence of a three year old wearing a Batman t-shirt. 

The difference is that I am not a coward that will conveniently "forget" or deny all the times I was wrong like people like yourself.

Oddly, I was very right about TMac, Funchess, TMJ and Mingo.  

Let me guess, you thought those last three "just needed more time." If fact, were you one of the lightspeed idiots that said we would regret trading Mingo to the Cowboys? I seem to recall you were.

19 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

He may not actually be under contract next season.

I'd have to look him up, but info on coaching contracts is not easy to find. 

Looked into it and this is the last year of his deal.

I would be very surprised if he either doesn't leave or completely bends them over a barrel on a contract extension.

4 minutes ago, CRA said:

the team that drafted him washed their hands of him after 3 years.  Bryce would get chances after Carolina.  But Fieldswill be 1 year stops until teams just admit he is at best a backup.  

Fields is even weirder than Bryce.  He is ever so slightly more efficient and individually productive than Bryce but call it a push.  Both are basically these one read QBs that can't really play and make reads into zone.  But Fields forever has some legit elite physical tools (his legs) that people keep wishing would allow them to solve the puzzle. 

for me, Bryce, Fields, and those types fall below even the Mitch Trubisky tier.  Which is a young dude w/ no reality of being more than a middle tier QB but actually is one (while the others are below bottom tier). 

They are all ultimately backup tier QB's, at best.

My assertion is that Fields is worse than Bryce BECAUSE of those insane physical abilities but I have beaten that horse plenty enough.

Chicago was smart to move on after three seasons while Fields had a tiny amount of value. I suspect Bryce will not have that when/if we decide to move him.

12 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

He may not actually be under contract next season.

I'd have to look him up, but info on coaching contracts is not easy to find. 

I think that is what he is saying, he may be gone anyway.

48 minutes ago, NorthTryon said:

 

Nope, they have the pitchforks out and torches lit for XL. Yet another guy in his second season who is the worst Panther to put on a jersey due to him not being another player they wanted to draft, didn't hit the ground running like a Jamar Chase, and any positives(blocking/getting open/running off coverage), are looked at as general nothing burgers. Even though traditionally a WR takes till year three to get it, according to huddle opinions, they should find an exit strategy now. 

You mean minus about the last 10 years of the NFL and WR's?

This is old school WR mentality when it definitely was true that rookie WR's took a considerable amount of time to adjust.

This isn't that time period. 

Unless you are still waiting because Funchess, TMJ and Mingo "just haven't been given enough time yet."