kungfoodude

TBD. Marshall may not be able to stay healthy or work out. And maybe Anderson isn't as expensive as we believe in free agency. Hopefully they both play well and it's a "good" tough decision like the Curtis Samuel decision was.

Yep. Our Sunshine crowd can't take opinions that don't have a starting 22 of All-Pros and Pro Bowlers but even being down on a player doesn't mean we want the player to fail or team to do bad. Now, there is a small portion that does exist here wishing us to fail because their little internet opinion tiff is more important than seeing the team do well. Those people are not real Panther fans. I have no desire to gloat about being right about Darnold because that means I got to watch yet another season of failure and watch the Panthers slide further down the NFL pecking list historically and currently. As a new season ticket holder, that ain't what I signed up for.

I wish I was that positive about Darnold but I personally believe he is just a standard first round bust QB and isn't likely to improve much more than Teddy did last year from his career averages. We will see what happens in a few months. As for the article, there is no chance of most of that being remotely accurate. Like you said, 32 teams aren't going to have good QB play.

I would certainly disagree with that. Brady and Manning are two examples of very vocal on field leaders. But not all elite or good QB's are vocal leaders, that I would agree with. Some are "lead by example" types. That was where I departed from some of the criticisms thrown at Fields as a prospect. The fact he was quiet or reserved in interviews didn't make me think he couldn't be a leader at QB.

Agreed. Just because I have very little faith in him doesn't mean I won't jump on board if he proves me wrong and becomes "the guy." Success doesn't have to be accomplished the way I want it to, I just want the success.

Yeah, he isn't going to be publicly critical of either of them. Plus, I don't think a lot of players are going to into a situation like that and start trashing a guy even personally unless there is some sort of history. Now, the things that may get said privately between players are a different story.

This is what we want to happen but be cautious translating that sort of arc to the NFL. Transitions like that are definitely not as easy in the NFL. College football is such a skewed system.

If he puts up those stats, he is our QB of the future. Small asterisk for if somehow he does that in a very bad season, which would seem extremely unlikely.

You mean a Cam style leader, very vocal and "Alpha?"

You sort of did. I will say that some of the guys considered "great" QB's definitely benefitted from the situations they were in, like a Terry Bradshaw. I think that was a little true more in the pre-free agency era where keeping a dynasty was much easier.

I can't help you understand what is likely to transpire here. You are just going to have to see for yourself.

So what you are saying is if Darnold fails here, it is because we are a dumpster fire of a franchise and not that he is a bust?

I think that largely eliminates them from being great. That is sort of the difference between great athletes and the good, average or below average guys. They don't need motivation or situations to make them great, it all comes from within. Doesn't mean that people didn't influence that long the way but I firmly believe that you could put Watson, Wilson, Brady, Rodgers or any of the elite QB's in the NFL on just about any team and they would still be great. Classic example of that....Barry Sanders. He was great and had nothing around him....ever.

My counter would be that an average QB's success is largely dependent on those around him. A great QB will be good to great regardless of the pieces.

I genuinely don't think you have any concept of what being a fan is. I think that is the real root of the problem.

I am not wishing him to do poorly because then we are sliding down the historic Browns/Bengals kind of slope. Not a place I want to be. But me hoping he works out doesn’t turn off the part of my brain that can see how flawed of a player he is and look at the history of these kind of reclamation project QB's. No amount of hoping is going to wash away those things. What will wash that away is performance on the field. I felt the same way about Teddy. Started the season very skeptical because I knew what he had been, started to buy in a little when we were winning games, then had the carpet ripped out from under me as he clearly because the reason we couldn't close games. Darnold feels like Teddy 2.0.

The issue is you read but don't comprehend.

I don't see how you can get complaining out of that. My point was that the dollars and "sense" of picking up that option only work if he is a wild success. In that scenario, he is getting paid regardless of being under an additional year or bring a free agent. Conversely, if he bombs, you are looking at another big cap charge off for a mistake you probably shouldn't have made. Really the only scenario that fits with the decision is if he is just kind of mediocre(which would be a big step up from his history). In that case the contract would make a lot of sense.

Agreed. But we only have where we have been, not where we are going. Let's hope the destination has a lot of hardware.

That math only assumes success, which is where your formula breaks down. Even if he is a wild success, it will likely still entail a big contract extension next year.

I don't think that was actually strong consideration, TBQH. In a similar vein to the Mac Jones/49ers situation, I think the media was taking off with a narrative because it generated views. I think the prospect evaluation process definitely led the Jets to knowing without a doubt that they were drafting a new QB.

You can laugh all you want but if he puts up similar numbers to his career averages, I don't think you are gonna see him starting in 2022. Same way with winning. If he doesn't win, he will be just as gone as Teddy. Remember last offseason when Teddy was going to be here a MINIMUM of two seasons? You saw how quickly that changed, right? I gotta be honest, I was dug in for a long haul rebuild but a lot of the vibes the owner, front office and coaching staff have given off are that they aren't content losing. Which, I think we as fans want to see. Panthers fans have accepted coach after coach that was okay with mediocrity. The question is, will we actually be able to build any success if we keep rinsing and repeating every offseason at QB? It took forever for Cleveland in that cycle.

We are quite objectively a bad franchise. 7 winning seasons in 27 is just bad. The bulk of the franchises with that sort of track record are largely the perennial cellar dwelling franchises. The thing that gives we fans hope is that our highest highs have been two Super Bowl appearances. That is something the bulk of the rest of the bad franchises can't say. Remember, that is legitimately what Tepper, our front office and coaching staff are up against. They have to find a way to have some sustained success. Sustained success has literally never happened in Panthers history. We are the NFL's only franchise to never have had back to back winning seasons.

The bar is that he needs to show he is a franchise QB. Not an average NFL starter, certainly not one of the objectively worst NFL QB's(which he has established). Honestly, anything other than that just isn't acceptable. If he can't be Jimmy Garoppolo, Ryan Tannehill or Jared Goff good, he is a bust. Acceptable results(and expectations) should be Kylar Murray/Baker Mayfield or better. If we can't be at least as good as two other highly regarded, athletic gunsligers...then he is a bust.