kungfoodude

Not to mention that Darnold is still a lower tier starter to upper tier backup QB. Far from a "success" story. Baker was a playoff caliber player with the team that drafted him. He doesn't fit this mold at all. Hell, look at his stats from Cleveland and it will make your head spin in comparison to the rest of the guys being mentioned there. Jones looks great so far but it's two games of that.

This is cherry picking and, quite honestly, with some suspect examples with recency bias. The overwhelming majority of bust QB's that teams move on from end up never amounting to anything more than a lower level starter to middling backup. I would wager likely greater than 95% in the past 25 drafts or so.

XL is a social media influencer masquerading as an NFL player, IMO. I think he is far more passionate about that poo than he is football. I think it shows on the field.

I would push back on the idea that Newton came into a dumpster fire. He came into a team with solid bones/talent that needed a retool, which we did. I promise you, had we plopped prime Cam into the mess that was our organization that Bryce arrived into, we certainly still wouldn't be talking about playoffs. Far better results, no doubt, but that is an easy bar to clear.

Agreed. I think they never seriously considered him an option even though he was/is miles better than Darnold. I think the ego stuff was massively overplayed. He was played for the Browns, a disaster organization, and he accomplished more than they have in years. He came here to another diaster organization that happened to be worse than Cleveland and he didn't succeed. But, how could he? Frankly, who the fug could? I think our general fanbase really underestimates how terrible this organization truly is. It can nuke anyone. poo, you see how Stroud is struggling with a damn good Texans team? Can you imagine how bad he would be here in our circumstances?? He can thank his lucky stars we made the choice we did.

I am beyond this idea of "development" with the Panthers. It just hasn't really happened here often enough and most of these "high potential, very raw" guys have just been flat busts for us. Wallace should have been on the pine for 2-3 years. And maybe at a place that actually DOES develop those type of players.

That was one battle I never understood. Darnold is so clearly terrible and Bryce was terrible with a false hope of being better. Now both are very obviously bad. I will say that Darnold at least developed into a rosterable player. Bryce may be out of the league in 2-3 seasons at his current track.

Honestly, that is probably worse, TBH. I would rather you just suck right out of the gate than have to think about what could have been for a decade plus.

You undervalue all the hard work and dedication it took to be this bad.

I still maintain Baker was not the issue in Cleveland. Cleveland was just extremely stupid to pine after a guy like Watson when Baker was wildly successful by Cleveland QB standards. I will say that Baker's later success does show how terrible the Panthers are as an organization. We had the likely long term answer on a cheap deal but we dropped the ball completely pining after Bryce Young. Unreal.

I am not saying that a chunk of this isn't true but some of these guys still thrive in less than stellar situations and then become serviceable or elite. So, an element of this is on the player too. Perhaps the team isn't developing you enough but are you putting in the work on your own? Are you trying to excel constantly? I think that comes down to internal versus external motivation. All of these truly great players seem to have an elite internal motivation to be great. I am doubtful that is Bryce. He seems like more of a standard "cog in the machine" guy.

That is a swap included, though. So the RGIII is a little bit worse. I think there are more of these disastrously bad trade ups than we realize, because it isn't happening to us like Bryce did.

FTFY

The best thing about him is his motor and ability to pursue when he is out of position, which he frequently is. Wallace seems to have absolutely atrocious instincts. He might be the worst LB we have fielded in the Tepper era, which is saying a lot.

It's even worse in a 3-4. Those guys are vital.

I looked at a few. RGIII trade up(2 to 6) was for an additional 2 firsts and a second. That's fuging insane.

Some of that stuff shows itself along the way. That is not doing your due dilligence during the process. Being a nutter should have raised it's ugly head. But, that relies on people around him telling you the full story too.

There have been some wild ones. Leaf. Rosen, etc. People are just forgetting some of the insane historical QB busts. A lot of that is the power of how bad that trade up was. I do think it has to be firmly in the top 2-3 worst NFL Draft trades, however. I would need to look at the history to see if any come close. Maybe Ricky Williams? IIRC, Ryan Leaf was a similar trade too.

Very unlikely, IMO. I think he has put enough on tape to be worth a 5th or 6th, at best. Depends on when he is traded, too. If it is ASAP, the value will be slightly higher because of the smaller cost contract wise(3rd year rookie versus expiring contract).

The thing that should concern a lot of people about these early QB "leaders" on draft boards is it is thick with guys that didn't come out in last years weak ass QB draft to improve thier position.

He bought them because NFL teams are a good investment. The value keeps skyrocketing.

Yeah and that's cool and all but we are several coaches and GM's into this cycle. The facts haven't changed at all during any of these transitions. It's extremely easy to see how poorly constructed this roster is. Just like it's extremely easy to see how poorly coached we are. Just like it's extremely easy to see how poorly these players play. It's all quite obvious, IMO.

Nah. He definitely isn't. There are some really massive ones. He will likely go down as a top mention in terms of QB busts.

I mean....about 2/3 of those "hits" you are listing are really far from proving anything. Tepper is ultimately to blame for all of this. Morgan has not appreciably improved us and DC appears to be a bottom tier HC.

The people that defend Tepper are in a sea of delusional thoughts. He is the worst owner in the NFL by a massive margin.