Martin

Haha, yeah I don’t know how to change the topic, but it sure was a typo

I feel like the draft is starting to turn our way in terms of the extreme performances we are seeing from Pitts and the WR group. Right now I see us getting a QB (Fields or Lance) or Sewell at 8, which would be an absolute home run

What a great signing this have turned out to be. I was not impressed when it happened, but happy that I was completely wrong.

After the initial surprise, I’ve come around on this one. Mac seems like a very good fit for Shanahan. So I can buy that. I don’t see a defensive player worth the 4th pick, so if I was the Falcons I would go with Pitts, that would elevate Ryan for the next couple of years. Too early to go for a rookie QB for them, Ryan has at least 3-5 years less.

Haha, I’ve had the same thing happen to me, Jalen in the 2nd round. I’ve always though he was a 1st round guy, but maybe not.

Don’t like Mond at all, only seen a few games but he is all over the place. If he was a starter for only one season, I could see him as having upside, but he has started 45 games, he is who he is, and that is not worth wasting a 2-3 rounder on. This is Will Grier all over again. One QB I could see taking a chance on in round 3 or later is David Mills from Stanford. High upside with limited play time due to injuries, looked awesome on his pro day.

Assuming we get a QB with the first pick without losing our 2nd rounder, what are the top LT options for us? I like the athleticism of James Hudson and D’Ante Smith, they feel like high upside guys that in the mold of Saints Terron Armstead (he also needed some development when drafted).

This would make our d-line fantastic. Question is how much he wants.

This years draft looks very strong for LT, but very weak for DTs. I loved the Brown pick last year and believe we can get a starter LT in the 2nd round this year. Also, for all the Wirfs live, he’s a RT.

I don’t think the 40 time is a good indicator of being an athlete. Romo was great at improvising when things broke down, and so are most of the folks on your list. The question is, have we seen Mac do it?

Did anyone see him at LT for the Cowboys last year? How did he look? Not expecting much, but descent is not a bad place to start. But I have no idea how he looked? Below is from panthers.com “That leaves left tackle, and while Erving has also bounced around himself, he's hoping that's where he could find a home. The former first-round pick of the Browns has played all five line positions in the NFL, but filled in at left tackle in Dallas last year when injuries hit. It brought him back to his days at Florida State, but he's also been around long enough to know things can change in an instant. "Yeah, you know nobody gives you anything in this league, that's first things first," Erving said when he arrived last week. "But they wanted me to come in here and compete to play left tackle. That's something I've been striving for and wanting to do for a long time in my career. I've bounced around, played a lot of different things, and it's taught me a lot of lessons, but being able to come back and play the position I started at would be just a great blessing.”

The “he has grit and moxie daring to throw on his pro day” comments are hilarious. “He was brave enough to show his deep ball is weak, what an awesome competitor he is”. I don’t understand the notion that he is better/faster at processing the game than the other QBs. Sark set him up with great first reads most of the time. Yes he executed well, but saying he process better than the other QBs is just pure speculation. There is no evidence whatsoever. Also, how can he not be in better shape after spending years in the Alabama program? Huge red flag in terms of his commitment to trying to be the best.

Like him or not, but how good of a player Orlovsky was as a player has no impact on his quality as an analyst, that’s just weak. As for Lance, he has all the physical attributes you want, and the offense he was in puts a lot on the QB, from calling protections, changing plays, snaps under center etc. Sure, he has only done it for one year, but most other QBs that have started for 2-3 years have done none of that. The leg thing is hilarious, if that is Orlovsky’s big concern, I’m not very concerned. Again, just one year as a starter in a lower division is not great, but he did a lot in that one year.

I can’t get over the fact that he looks pudgy and out of shape. It not the end all be all, but it really bothers me. and spare me the Brady comparisons, he’s a one in a million player

Thanks for sharing the number comparison. I think I just look at the 18 ppg and wish we had that with one of our bigs on an ongoing basis. We are strong at both guards spots and SF, but PF and C is holding us back. Not sure what else we could find to improve.

As some other people have said as well. He is innocent until proven otherwise. But it is very concerning and he’s pretty much untouchable until this is resolved. And I don’t think it will get resolved before the draft.

Trade suggestion from the Athletic. I like it myself. I know he’s young, but I’m constantly underwhelmed by PJ. John Collins to the Charlotte Hornets Also: Charlotte sends its 2021 first-round pick (top-4 protected) to Atlanta Here we go Hornets! Charlotte adds a top-notch young big man to play the rim-running role next to LaMelo Ball, one they can comfortably sign this offseason given they’ll have massive cap room and the market isn’t exactly flooded with talent. In fact, Collins’ low cap hold is a real boon here, as Charlotte should have $20 million in room even with Collins’ number on the books before they go over the cap to re-sign him. That should be enough for a half-decent center to round this group out. A perimeter quarter of Ball-Rozier-Hayward-Collins is primed to do some serious damage offensively, and that’s worth surrendering a first-round pick likely to be in the mid-teens, plus Graham and P.J. Washington. Graham represented a thorny issue for Charlotte with his restricted free agency coming up, but will be welcomed with open arms by an Atlanta team desperate for improved backup point guard play. The Hawks also have ample room below the tax to retain Graham in free agency, and his long-range shooting should allow him to play in two-guard lineups next to Trae Young. Meanwhile, Washington fills Collins’ role for the next two seasons at a much more affordable price, important given that the Hawks were flinching at paying a potential max deal for Collins. He’s not a great defender and not the rim-runner that Collins is, but can play three positions and offers much more salary flexibility going forward.

Trai feels like the opposite of what Rhule is looking for. He wants hard working, tough, playing through injury, self motivated etc. players. The last few years Trai felt like nothing of the above. Felt like he quit a bit when he got his big contract, until then he was awesome. I think we’ll resign Miller to a 3-year contract at a good price.

I think he might be back as well, but as a bridge for a rookie QB. If that is the case I’m ok ish with that so we don’t have to rush the rookie. But I’d be even more happy with another veteran QB

I’m the same way, I continue to go back and forth between Wilson, Fields and Lance in the first round. Not interested in Mac until maybe later. It is going to be a wild draft this year, and part of me love it.

This is from the Athletic. Strongly recommend it, worth paying for. Quarterbacks (6) Trevor Lawrence, Clemson (6-foot-6, 220 pounds): In three seasons, he passed for 90 touchdowns and ran for another 18. “Rare arm talent,” said one scout. “He’s humble, a faith-based guy. He’ll handle anything being the franchise quarterback. There are a lot of people who say he’s the best quarterback to come out since Andrew Luck. Is he a product of the system? Everything that comes out of there says he really is smart. This year, he started getting his touch back. His accuracy was better.” Lawrence went through an individual workout Feb. 12, four days before undergoing surgery to repair labrum damage in his non-throwing shoulder. Expected to be ready by mid-July. “He is a great athlete and has a strong arm,” a second scout said. “The guy has a chance to be great. But you break him down, game after game, he’s not an accurate passer. Where he has problems is inside the numbers. Inconsistent touch. Is he Josh Allen or Blake Bortles? Bortles was a big-time athlete, but he wasn’t accurate. People were all excited about size and the way Bortles could run. … The ACC is not a good league, OK? The only real competition they (Clemson) get every year is in the playoffs. He didn’t play well. Even when they beat Ohio State, he beat them running, not passing. They totally shut the guy down.” Finished second in Heisman Trophy voting in 2020, seventh in ’19. “I’d take Joe Burrow over Trevor Lawrence,” said a third scout. “He was a better player. More of a playmaker. The ACC stinks. Everything is so easy for him. This was for three years. Now when he played LSU, Ohio State this year, Miami, Virginia Tech, there were times he had to speed up and he looked average. When you put him against other elite competition, he has not stepped up. When Deshaun Watson was there and he played Alabama two years in a row, that guy was by far the best player on the field. A superstar. I never saw that with Trevor Lawrence. On designed things he can run, but if he has to quickly get out of trouble, he does not do that well. If he threw for 300 yards in a game, 250 of it would be just the quick design of the offense. Their coordinator (Tony Elliott) is amazing.” Zach Wilson, Brigham Young (6-foot-2, 210 pounds):Three-star recruit. “He will not be the first pick in the draft, but he should be,” one scout said. “Love him. He’s just a natural. He just has the movement, the looseness, the throwing from all angles, the jumping around in the pocket. His release is quick as hell. He can throw the ball. He is a nifty, elusive type in the pocket. He can run a little bit.” Battled injuries as the starter in 2018 and ’19, and underwent surgeries to repair a labrum and hand. Vastly improved in 2020 with an NFL passer rating of 138.2, up from 84.9 in 2019. Some scouts worry that his slight frame might lead to durability issues. “How big is he?” asked one. “He’s only going to be like 205 (pounds). He may be only 6-(foot)-1. He’s been spoiled a little bit, too.” A fourth scout described him as a combination of Kyler Murray and Patrick Mahomes. Retorted another scout: “There’s a vast difference (to Mahomes). The physical skills of throwing the football, he’s not even close to humming the ball like Patrick. I don’t know if he’s innately competitive and tough as Patrick. Patrick’s probably smarter, too.” Justin Fields, Ohio State (6-foot-3, 228 pounds): Spent his freshman season at Georgia before transferring and becoming a two-year starter. “He’s a modern-day RPO quarterback,” said one scout. “He’s a naturally accurate ball thrower and the ball gets out of his hands, too. He’s not a runner like Lamar (Jackson), but he’s way better than Jalen Hurts was. He will have to learn progressions. Very athletic. Very cool demeanor. Plus, he’s sturdy.” Led the Buckeyes to a 1-2 record in the College Football Playoff. “Love his makeup, the playmaking, his competitiveness, the movement,” a second scout said. “He’s poised. He stepped up in the big games. He’s just not a quick processor in the pocket. He’s more methodical. That’s a worry. He had the streak in the Indiana game: ‘What is this guy doing?’” Passed for 67 TDs and ran for another 19. “He is one of the top athletes (at quarterback) of all time,” a third scout said. “Best thing Fields does is throw the deep ball. But is he Jameis Winston? That’s who I see. I see the best quarterback in the draft on one play, and on the next play, I see a guy that makes stupid mistakes. Throws off his back foot a lot. Has a lot of balls tipped. He’s a first-rounder, but I wouldn’t take him until the bottom (of the round).” Passer rating was 127.6. “He played his worst game in the Big Ten Championship (game) against Northwestern, yet they still found a way to win,” said a fourth scout. “People are saying they don’t even belong there (in the playoff), and he plays a damn near perfect game against Clemson. In the national championship, he carried them. What would be ideal for him would be to go somewhere and not have to play the first year. But the physical talent is so wow, they’re going to see that in practice and say, ‘This guy has to play.’ There needs to be a tremendous amount of growth, which I think he is capable of.” Ohio State’s Justin Fields. (Tim Fuller / USA Today) Mac Jones, Alabama (6-foot-2½, 217 pounds): Started the final four games of 2019 for an injured Tua Tagovailoa, then went all the way in ’20 for the national champions. “They may have had the best offense this year in the history of college football, but Joe Burrow had a great supporting cast, too,” said one scout. “He is totally amazing when you break him down. Disciplined person, excellent work ethic, goal-oriented. He has a feel (for the rush). The great ones are not big-time runners. Poised, confident. I think he’ll probably go middle of the first.” Completed a record 77.4 percent of his passes in 2020. “He could be the steal of the bunch,” said a second scout. “Nobody’s saying, ‘Hey, he’s this guy,’ but there are some Tom Brady comparisons.” Countered a third scout: “How can anyone compare him to Brady? I wouldn’t compare anybody to Tom Brady. Ever. How many guys with similar tools failed? If this guy’s the next Brady, trade your next seven first-round picks. Give up your head coach. Trade your owner.” His passer rating of 143.1 in 2020 left his career mark at 138.2. “When I watched him, I said this was A.J. McCarron all over again,” a fourth scout said. “The offense. The players around him. He’s got a slow delivery. He labors in his movements. If he’s in rhythm and everything is working for him, he’s a machine. I just question everything about his natural talent, his playmaking, his ability to face pressure and make plays.” Practiced at the Senior Bowl but missed the game because of an ankle injury. “Honestly, I wasn’t very impressed with him at the Senior Bowl,” said a fifth scout. “I just didn’t think he stood out at all. He stood out in a bad way. He didn’t look very strong. He didn’t look very athletic. He just didn’t look like a starter you want in the NFL.” Trey Lance, North Dakota State (6-foot-4, 226 pounds): Redshirted in 2018, started 16 games for the FCS national champions in ’19 and started the Bison’s only game in ’20. “He’s really talented,” one scout said. “I’m not going to say he throws it better than Trevor Lawrence, but he definitely throws it better than Zach Wilson and as well as (Justin) Fields arm strength-wise. Josh Allen was more talented, but a year ago Lance was a much more efficient player. Josh threw interceptions in college, especially against good defenses. Lance definitely fits the mold of what you want to look for. The natural, God-given ability, he has it.” Posted a passer rating of 130.1 in 2019 while running for 1,100 yards and 14 TDs. “He’s a better runner than Lawrence and the same level as Fields,” said a second scout. “He’s an aggressive runner. That’s the problem. He takes on people all the time. Physically, he’s gifted. He’s a myth, a one-year-and-one-game starter.” Playing in Fargo Oct. 3 against a Central Arkansas team that finished 5-4, Lance was 15-of-30 for 149 yards, two TDs and one interception. He did rush 15 times for 143 yards. Declared for the draft three days later. “He should not have played that game,” said a third scout. “He looked awful. Looked like a fourth-round pick. No accuracy. No pocket poise. He fumbled the ball. He looked like a developmental backup guy. Straight-line type athlete. He reminded me of Jameis Winston where it’s not really a fluid, natural motion or natural movement in the pocket. He kind of has to gather his whole body to throw.” Two scouts said they’d take him over Jordan Love. “You like the taste, but it’s a small sample,” a fourth scout said. “I like his tools. I think he can be good, but would I bank on it? There’s not enough information for me. A lot of unknowns there that would give me pause.” Kyle Trask, Florida (6-foot-4½, 240 pounds): High-school backup in Manvel, Texas, who was offered by the Gators based on his showing at a camp. “He didn’t even start in high school,” said one scout. “He’s lucky to be a starting quarterback. He has numbers, but I think there’s better out there.” Redshirted in 2016, broke his left foot in August 2017 and broke his right foot in September 2018. Took over the starting job in 2019. “Reminds me of Jared Goff,” said a second scout. “Pocket quarterback with height, arm strength, accuracy. High three-quarters release, quick release. Tight ball. Throws well in and outside the numbers. He can move around the pocket, but he doesn’t have quickness. He does have good pocket awareness. I think he’s a first-rounder.” Posted a passer rating of 117.1. Improved each year. “Similar to (Mac) Jones,” a third scout said. “He’s got a little more moxie than Mac. He’s a game manager. Average arm. He’s gets in rhythm good, but if he has to reset and throw, it’s over with. He’s a backup type. If he ends up starting, you’ve got a bad team.” Tossed three interceptions for the Gators’ depleted offense in their first three possessions of the Cotton Bowl, his final game. Said a fourth scout: “We see him as a backup. He can’t move. Totally immobile.”

I have to say, I really enjoy the Athletic, especially their draft coverage. I think Brugler is really good, and then you add in McGinn etc. Person is also really good, feels like he found his style. I’ll try to post the QB comments later

I was thinking the same thing. Seem to have most traits, “just” needs good coaching and development to start late year 1, early year 2

Bob McGinn does this really cool draft write up every year where he interview a bunch of scouts about some of the top prospects. Hudson is an interesting LT prospect in round 2-3, anyone seen him play? James Hudson, Cincinnati (6-foot-4½, 302 pounds): Redshirted as a defensive lineman at Michigan in 2017 before moving to tackle in ’18 and playing in three games. Transferred in ’19, but Michigan contested his release. Didn’t make his debut with the Bearcats until the Birmingham Bowl in late 2019. Started at left tackle in ’20. “He’s raw, but he’s probably the best natural athlete (among the offensive linemen in the draft),” one scout said. “He’s quick. He’s aggressive. He plays like a (defensive) lineman. He tries to strike guys, which is to his detriment at this point. He’s got to learn some patience and technique. He’s got a lot to work with.” Was removed from consideration by one team because of off-field factors. “He’s got some issues with consistency and maturity,” said another scout. “He may not be a first- or second-round pick on every board, but I would bet money that he is on 10 of them. If one team brings him in and lets him talk to their doctors and they say he’s fine, they’ll take him in the second. You only have to get picked by one.”