davos

This. Stiffy McGee. You watch him and he has no fluid route-running skills. He just runs himself open and plays jump ball. He’s at that level and is a 5th year. Make it NFL speed, NFL talent, and this kid, as emotional his story is and being local and all, is going to hit a brick wall. Have we learned nothing? Seriously. This would be such an aggravating selection. Another plus athlete with the potential needing to be tapped. He’ll need to be designed around and not with until he can develop.

What even was that playcall at :22? That's an example of one I want to see in All-22. There is like no one running slants or shallow crosses within 10 yards the bulk of the time. We had one okay slant with Thielen at :38 but it's either deep routes or curls galore. Ran a bunch to the right at :48 but Thielen is jogging and the other two go deep out of frame. There's no patterns playing off each other. Bryce's first look was to the weak side at Hurst. Like, what they hell was drafted up there? 1:00 & 1:15 are nice. But again the strip sack at 1:35, what was that pattern set? I gotta see that one. 1:42 clean pocket and no one open? That is needed in All-22. Need to see what's going on out of frame. The next few plus were inaccurate. Then 2:33, I need to see what's happening there. Had the time and the looks.Same at 2:42, looked like falf the routes were given up on. WRs look mad slow. And then Saints went to soft zone. YIKES

Which is why it's so weird we're not trying to stretch the defense horizontally. We don't have the personnel to stretch vertically (arguably do with Mingo and Chark meeting potential), but are still running triangle concepts that the defense is easily diagnosing. I have officially given up on TMJ however. Reich was able to open guys up in the middle of the field for Rivers and Wentz with that Hi-Lo and mesh stuff and we're just not really doing any of that. Lots of snag routes or plays where everyone's leaning one way and ~one guy to dump off to the counter. We're just not not isolating the right guys or designing for favorable matchups with our personnel. And then in that, without the ability to get decent separation, the 3 on 2s Reich likes to make get obliterated pretty quickly with Marshall tripping on his dick. My take is that we absolutely need Shenault in there right now along with a burner RB; need to have a hard focus on stretching things out to open the flat for Bryce. They gave us all these fluff pieces (like below), but reality is, Reich is still just using Reich. Very little from the McVay/Shanahan tree. https://www.panthers.com/news/how-thomas-brown-and-frank-reich-blended-offensive-philosophies

Absolutely. What I'm just getting at is that this looks unfortunately similar to Frank's Indy offense . It's dissapointing because he sold us that they were developing something new, learning from his past. It's quite evident, it's not us easing Bryce into anything, the offense is not in the mold of the more popular stretch zone style stuff that's all the rage. The forefront offenses are all about stretching defenses horizontally--then countering with bunch formations and pre-snap motions to keep them on their feet just when the defense thinks they're getting a handle. It's about a rhythm between those calls. Play designs allow for high percentage targets early and naturally opens the field up. Has made life easy on Purdy, Tua, and Baker thus far this year. We're just not implementing any concepts that stretch the field and open the D up. We're in single back, shotgun, and pistol, running triangle patterns (vertical and horiz stretching is combined). So we're just running stuff like a snag pattern and Bryce is natural drifting to his right with the corner route as primary. In concept, this should leave some easy guys open, but it has been more often just the RB that runs to the flat/rail and Bryce sends it off for a short gain. They have been bragging about how high a percentage they've been able to install with Bryce already so this isn't some limited portion of it. What they've installed seems very antiquated (early 2010s)

Pierce and Shultz have produced next to nothing so far this season for Stroud thus far. This is not a good argument to make.

Yeah, hard to spin it otherwise, although love Tank. He led CFB in multiple categories for a reason. HOU has arguably the worst WR group in the last 5 years right now. One of the only ones arguably worse than ours.

The omission of concepts shouldn't limit what we're giving Young. You create a more limiting system within the same concept and grow it from there for these guys. This doesn't look like we're pulling anything from successful modern offenses. The framework isn't there.

I just don't get why we aren't running wide-zone concepts, sails, stretching things out and then countering to open the middle of the field. They also aren't setting anything up in the flat appropriately for quick easy yards. And not doing this when we have Brown & McNown in house when it's supposedly a collaboration. McVay is still slapping at 100 mph, Canales is doing it quite well in TB, Waldron in SEA, Shanahan in SF...it's the modern NFL and we still aren't doing it. They hyped us up about a big collaborative offense taking from all the successful modern ones, but it looks like the bad Reich in Indy. There's more draws than we've seen before in some time and what seems just like a dated scheme with some dated pistol wrinkles. Not enjoyable football.

I want one of those all-22 people that spend hours on end with this stuff to make a breakdown after this one. Even more so than last week to scope this out. I'd like to see traced route trees on some of these playcalls in singleback where it was deeping stepping dropbacks. It was just very, very ugly. I saw so little condensed formations, angular running attacks in wide zone, sails routes. Virtually no daggers.

It's not an end all be all and they have the capability to do so with the right schemes that aren't archaic triangle patterns. We have Adam Thielen & DJ Chark along with a compeltely viable TE in Hurst. This is not some incompetent receiving group people keep making it out to be. TMJ is lost however, I concede. The play design is not acceptable and there is no rhythm/structure to the call response. The runs are redundant and they aren't running enough motions or using any sort of pre-snap movements that make modern offenses successful. Just look at the Rams right now with Tutu Atwell, a 5th rounder, and an aging Stafford. You have a good coach, scheme, approach, you'll make it happen. It's so much about coaching and this is not a good sign out of the gate. No hard line in the sand (yet) but this is some disgusting football.

For having 3 ex-NFL QBs on this staff, one a SB winning OC as HC, an OC that's a McVay disciple/SB winner (and close companion), and a SB-winning HC consulting the offense, it is incredibly disappointing we can barely muster 150 yards in the air, now two games in a row. What worked against ATL was done even less. We simply aren't running a competent offense. The lack of response and effective adjustments after game 1 is incredibly concerning. Furthermore, the lack of nuance to the sequence of playcalls is reminiscent of Foxball. This would make Matt Stafford look like CJ Beathard.

Step one is giving Thomas Brown more room to see if Bryce looks different with a different OC attacking the gameplan and playcalls. If Bryce continues to struggle, then you start a bit harder tests.

I'm kind of on the other side as time goes by. I honestly get packaging Moore to make a trade for a top QB. It sucked, but you swallow that pill, take the gamble, if you think you found your guy. I understand the gamble. What I still really don't understand, is we had a perpetual OPOY candidate, 26 years old, one of the biggest stars in the NFL, the best possible guy to have for a rookie QB, and the first step we take into a rebuild was giving him away to the top team in our own conference for a few mid-rounders. No players in return, just a few draft picks. Someone, please explain that to me. I guess it made some sense at the time to collect assets, but we didn't blow the team up! We tried a soft reset. The more that time goes by, I'm trying to understand exactly what we were trying to accomplish with that.

This brother has no touch and awful mechanical discipline. All the tools in the world he can easily shown off today, but doesn't really use them well in the actual games. Poor Kentucky team aside. I've seen this tale all too often.

Woah my man—what’s cracking? Rare post!

Also man, DPantherman was here forever and posted a ton and then vanished. Whatever happened to that dude?

What a throwback. Wanted McD form the start! But I also wanted some dude named Winston Moss. And I don't remember him haha.

There's so much that could be added too

and will also probably claim that they were actually fine with taking Bryce, they were just misconstrued.

Around this time last year, people were creaming, and I mean creaming over a stacked class with Van Dyke, Richardson, Young, Levis, & Stroud. Fast-forward, now here we are, they're all nitpicked to death and everyone hates all prospects. And many things evolve over the course of a season, some don't look as good as teased. Just check out 2023 mocks in the Nov 2021-May 2022 range. Van Dyke and Richardson were all the rage. Rewind another year it was Rattler, Howell, & Strong that were all going to be legit. Not to mention our very own Cade Mays being a popular top-15ish selection in many mocks on the OL. Maye & Caleb look fine, sure. But it is a waste of breath pining for them with an entire 1.5 years of life happening until that possibility is even there. Never fall, and I mean NEVER fall for next class syndrome.

Honestly, if you want to help maximize our chances at the position, go the RGIII/Cousins route--take Young/Stroud and then a Ward/Tune/McKee later. Keep swinging, don't settle for what we have when what we have is honestly more uncertain than half of the prospects in the draft given how shut out he's been and will be a year removed from the field.

yessir The perspective of wanting to just roll with Corral+a JAG scrub are no different than those wanting BPA+[insert their "sleeper" QB pick] in the draft. You're getting a 2nd-4th round QB prospect either way and neglecting the very thing that's preventing us from winning outside of a legit coach. There's no issue rooting or being hopeful for Corral, I do take issue with those making him out to be some type of plug-in starter next year and drop in some Brian Hoyer with him. He's nowhere close and may never be with now essentially a year removed and no good coaching to grow under while injured. He's basically a developmental 3rd string. Those wanting Corral+JAG scrub will be the same people whining about not selecting a Stroud or Young if they turn out to be something. In 2 years they're asking "where can we find the next Young? How do we keep missing out??", meanwhile, dissing every top prospect in that future draft, pining for their next can't miss mid/late rounder of Carson Strong/Ricky Stanzi significance.

Corral seems like a guy who truly needs a vet, not just a mid-career average JAG to show him the ropes. He is also basically having a scratch year when this is at least the time to be acclimated into the NFL setting. Given the system he came from and likely where he's at developmentally, he needs someone in front of him to show him the ins and outs. Talking at least a Cousins, Carr type guy. Buuut this is why our situation just isn't ideal for him. I doubt having him go against another Baker type pickup in camp will help him out. Combine our likelihood of getting a QB R1, it's just not something to really get too excited about from my perspective.