AU-panther

I'm a fan of drafting Oline but what about KC? Didn't they revamp some of it through FA and trades?

? I was trying to explain a mindset, sorry if you didn't follow.

I never said those players were not higher rated then Pickett, I'm not sure I would draft Pickett in the top 10. My point is that very rarely will a QB be the highest rated player on a team's board at any given point in a draft, which you disagreed with. There will almost always be a safer non QB pick, short of having the number 1 pick in a Manning or Luck type of year. Even with Cam there safer picks, but as some point a team has to gamble somewhat on a QB.

I wasn't talking about the panthers specifically. I was referring to this mindset that when people don't want to trade down, they convince themselves that the player available at the spot they are at is exponentially better than the next available pick. "If Neal is available at 6 i don't want to trade down because he is a 100% chance of being a hall of famer and the next guy only has a 50% of being good" This mindset happens every year and every year history tells us its not true. I'm sure fans last year said the same thing about Sewell and Slater. "If Sewell is available stay put because the drop off is too much to the next guy" Turns out Slater is looking to be just as good. The lions could have traded down and got more assets.

In all those examples there were hither rated players available that were statistically safer. Sewell was probably rated higher than Wilson on most boards, maybe Chase and Pitts also. At the very least any logical person would consider them safter picks. Derrick Brown was rated higher than Herbert and was considered safter by most also. Watson wasn't even drafted in the top 10 so that tells you everything you need to know. If teams had him rated that high he would have never fallen out of the top 10 being a QB. They might have been rated high but this idea that they were BPA is naive. Fact is QBs are almost always inherently a greater risk then a non QB that is also available at that same position. This is too be expected because its a much more important position.

Even with Wilson being rated that high you could make the arguemetn that Pitts, Chase, or Sewell had higher higher grades and were "safer" picks. QBs are very rarely the safest pick at any point in any draft.

Exactly ^ You don't need a good O-line to be a good team, but you do need a good QB. A good QB with an average O-line will win more games then a good O-line with an average QB. An o-line doesn't have to be great just good enough to allow your QB to be great. With that being said our O-line has been next level bad so our fans have a hard time understanding that.

Thats a valid question. Maybe him playing G, means we have an even worse person playing LT. Maybe its not that think he is a worse guard than those two but they think he is a better backup LT than anyone else at this point? If Cam Erving stays healthy all year does BC maybe play more guard and end up winning one of those spots?

and they went first. hence the reason I said "unless you have the 1st overall pick"

2015? that's convenient 2014 Greg Robinson 2013 Luke Joekel 2012 Matt Kalil I do agree they are a lot safer than QBs, but lets don't act like they are sure things

maybe, maybe not First of all there is no guarentee that Darnold will be starting, maybe they bring in someone else. Also look at the dolphins in 2019, they went out of their way to tank for Tua, terrible roster and they still ended picking 5th, turned out Tua fell to them anyway, but the point is you can't always guarntee that you will have a top pick. If we do decide to go for a QB in 2023 then we probably need to to commit to being bad and maybe trade one or two of players for picks, such as Moore or Burns.

So what happens when you improve the oline and you go 8-9 and you are picking 14th, and since its a better QB class all of the good QBs go in the top 10 and you end up picking a QB that you have rated lower than what you can get this year.

Nobody is going to think any of these QBs are a safer pick then some of the non-QBs in this draft. That isn't the point. QBs are almost never the safter pick, sooner or later you just have to gamble. With that being said this might not be the year to gamble, or maybe by trading down you reduce the gamble somewhat by acquiring extra picks but people need to give up on this idea that a QB is going to be the BPA. Unless you happen to have the 1st overall pick in a year there is a Luck or Lawrance type talent it just doesn't happen.

One year wonder, without any overly spectacular physical tools, definitely not the kind of prospect that fans get excited about. Like you said though, a lot of the same things fans said about Burrow and now he is looking like one of the best QBs in the league. Teams that need QBs will talk themselves into prospects, when looking at Pickett they will keep thinking about Burrow. I'm sure Josh Allen helped Trey Lance some, physical Qbs with tools that were inaccurate. Lamar Jackson will help Willis get drafted. Its just the way the league works. Mahomes got people excited about Wilson. He feels somewhat risky to draft that high but he might prove us all wrong, the little I have watched he does seem to do some things well.

Even if BC isn't able to be a great guard I'm not sure i still pass on a LT that I think can be great just to keep a LT that is solid. I get what you are saying about wasting resources but OT is one place I don't mind "wasting" a little. It would just be hard for me to pass on a guy that I think can be a top flight LT if my current guy might top out at above average. I almost value my OT3 as much or more than some of my starters. How many times does someone get hurt, or they become a free agent. Tackles are so expensive and so hard to find, especially ones that can play on the left. How many times has a team gone into a big game and had a tackle hurt and it actually cost them? it seems to happen alot Like you said if Rhule would have played him more this would be an easier question to answer.

people fall in love with certain players (neal) and feel like that they are in a league all by themselves and the next guy at the position is nowhere near as safe as a pick so they are afraid to trade back. People said the same thing about Sewell and Slater last year. Last year you probably would have said the same thing picking at 7 with Sewell, but looking at it now would you take Slater and an extra pick?

or you draft the LT and you might end up with a good LT, good LG (BC), and good RT and you find an average center elsewhere.

Neal is pretty much a consensus top 5 or 10 pick by most people whereas Little was considered a round 2 or 3 pick by most people. He might not work out but I wouldn't worry about Little as a comparison.

Jacob Tuioti-Mariner Stats | Pro-Football-Reference.com He is 6'2 285lbs, he might not do much worse than what we have

I don't think it is Gantts tweet, the scores above are from a different twitter from what I can tell, I would guess they were probably taken from PFF, but I don't think PFF generated the actual graphic, the logo is to give them credit I think. The article from PFF is probably the preliminary grading, the grade in the graphic is probably the final grade that this PNP panther site pulled from having a subscription, but that is just my guess.

Panthers Pro Football Focus grades: Best and worst from Week 17 (usatoday.com) Nice to see BC at 70.6, considering another post had his pass block at 77 we can surmise his run block was a bit behind, but probably not atrocious. Speaking of atrocious the bottom 5.......

The PFF article you linked is the recap that PFF does right after the game, and often it changes later, they even say it's a preliminary grading. The tweet posted in the original post I don't think was put out by PFF, it seems to me to be created by some other people, some podcast, with scores they most likely get from having a PFF subscription. To get game by game grades you have to have the higher level subscription to PFF so I can't verify either way.

What does that have to do with the question I asked? You said Tepper needed to let football people make decisions then later you said he didn't. I'm confused So Rhule had no part of getting rid of Teddy?

I didn't say anything about impatient. You said Tepper needed to let the football people make the decisions but then you said Tepper didn't need to let them do anythign stupid by mortgaging the future. Which is it?

Once you get past the first round the positional value becomes less important because the salaries are so much close to league minimum. People need to realize that football moves don't happen in a vacuum. You spend $8m to draft an above average center then you have to spend about $15m to get an above average LT (if one even hits the market). or You spend $8m to draft an above average LT then you can spend $15m on a free agent center, which would actually make them the highest paid center in the league (highest is 13.5m). The same thing is true with positions like RB. If you draft one that high he has to be one of the best players in the league or he starts out overpaid. For the most part free agents are paid relative to their production. Think of dollars=production. A $10m player gives you $10m dollars of production. In that regard all teams are equal because of salary cap. The one place teams can really get ahead of another team is through the draft because of the fixed contracts. If you draft a $20m player on a $2m contract you have gained value over another team. Of course there are always exceptions, but the principle is true. It's the reason the Saints stayed competitive during the so called "cap hell" years. They had one of the best drafts of all times and basically had several high production players on cheap rookie deals, that make up for their reduced cap space. If I did decide to draft the center I would feel a lot better about it with a trade down. That extra pick gives you a chance to make up for some of the value lost by drafting a lower value position to start with.