SmokinwithWilly

I'd be happy making millions just to sit on the bench.

I agree with that. Moving 1 or 2 spots up, ok, depending on the cost. Moving to 1 from 9, nope. Moving to 1 from 20, I don't even want to know what that would cost. Cheap rookie contracts are the only way to really be competitive. You have to hit on your picks at impact positions to have a chance for a deep playoff run year after year. Bills and the WR group are a perfect example. Elite QB, no one to catch it.

Brissett's stats, 280.5 YPG, 1.96 TPG, and .67 IPG, averaged out to 16 games would have been 4488 yards, 31 TDs, 11 Ints. He also had a higher YPA and completion %. You can't just dismiss stats like that and say that they don't count, because they do. That's good QB play, regardless of what the team record is. A QB that did that during the season could have competed with Bryce in camp. You think if Bryce missed is game and Brissett comes in and does that, Bryce is getting his job back? Ain't happening. And if you think it is, you're the one who's dreaming, not me.

Dalton did have decent numbers that game but he was under immense pressure in Seattle in the rain. If I remember correctly, Zavala gave up 14 QB pressures that game alone. That's inexcusable and the position certainly needed to be addressed. But just think of what we could have done with a center like Frazier, JPJ, Linderbaum, or Humphrey. I realize Dan didn't have the opportunity to draft all these guys. But having a stud in the shortest route to the QB calling protections for the other guys, that's how you build for any QB to run an offense. I'm an offensive line guy. It's my favorite group on the field. I call it fat man ballet. It's a combination of quick feet, balance, bend, strength, reflexes and pure grit. Center is your core leadership on the field, tackles are a combination of finesse and strength, and guards, they're angry dudes that get to have way too much fun hitting people.

I'm ok with doing it if it's the final piece to going all in, as long as you're legitimately in a position to do so. Rams trading 2 1sts and a 2nd for Burns when they desperately needed an edge rusher to be a top contender for a Lombardi. Not a fan, but I get it. Rings are more important than picks, but they were missing one or 2 pieces to be dominant on both sides of the ball. Trading 2 1sts for Parsons when GB wasn't on the verge of greatness, an overpay in my estimation.

Brissett 3366 yards 23/8 41.2 QBR in 14 games, starting 12. Bryce 3011 23/11 47.6 QBR starting 16 games. Let's not pretend Bryce was a dominant force at the QB position. And I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying about getting a QB2 with the potential to be a QB 1. None of those QBs were taken to be a QB1, but they became that anyway when given the opportunity. Develop a QB2 and develop him into a QB that could be a QB1. If he does and you end up trading him as a potential starter to another team for a 1st or 2nd, great. If you keep him, great. Either way, he's still an asset to the team. There's nothing wrong with developing assets.

We're in a unique position where our starting QB is at the bottom end of the league in performance. A backup like Brisset last year would have challenged Bryce for the starting role, hell, he might have taken it given how he performed last year. He wouldn't have challenged a Mahomes or a Burrow, but the need of a QB2 with the potential to be a long term QB1 if need be is now pretty apparent after significant injuries derailed their respective seasons. After we've established our long term starting QB, keep trying to develop a QB2 with potential to be a QB1. Don't want to end up in KC or Cinci situation.

I'm not speaking about this QB room alone. This needs to be a policy. I've said before as much as I despise Belichek, he always worked on developing a QB2 that was capable of being a QB1. Brady, Cassel, Jimmy G, all backups that became starters for NE or elsewhere. Personally, I'm not a fan of just having a "backup". Every player is one injury away from ending their career. I would much rather be proactive than reactive with the most important position on the field.

No matter what we still need a QB2 with potential to be a QB1. Keep throwing QBs at the wall until we find someone who sticks.

I'm one of the ones that won't let it go because it didn't solve the problem. We didn't address the center position which was a huge mistake. We were in position to easily take 2 or the top IOL. Instead of drafting JPJ over XL or Frazier over Brooks, we relied on an oft injured guard to center conversion and lo and behold, it failed as predicted. XL looks like a 1 year college wonder and an injured Brooks hasn't even surpassed Eric Shelton. Bryce was also benched for poor performance, so the issue that many claimed was solely bad oline play wasn't. It didn't fix him bailing out of tight pockets because of being unable to see the field or him refusing to work on his atrocious footwork. Then there's the $$$. Lewis got a good guard payday. Hunt got a tackle payday. Pay tackles, draft guards, if you can. I have no issues addressing problems through FA. It was not addressing C at all that's been the issue and still has been. Ryan Kalil was the anchor of our offensive line. We had years of solid center play and it showed. Now we're still piecemealing the center position with an expensive oline and it's still a shitshow. Why? Because the player responsible for what happens on the line presnap has little to no experience doing it. We did acquire a FA center this year finally. We'll see how much that impacts the line. Spending on a center, whether it be through draft or FA is not bad. It's not a position that can have anyone just thrown in with no drop off in performance. A great center lifts the play of the guards on each side. I don't like how we've built the line because we've ignored the hinge pin that everyone counts on every play. And the reality of the situation is, it didn't solve the actual problems with Bryce because those have nothing to do with the oline.

If we go all in and sell out with Bryce as our QB, it will even more entrench the idea that Tepper is at minimum running the QB room for me. Now i could be wrong and Dan really is that confident in Bryce all by himself, but nothing this team has done in the past 3 offseasons leads me to believe that there hasnt been some noise from big T. He's admitted that he walks through the office making his opinion known. To me, Bryce's output has just not generated that kind of confidence that we are playoff worthy other than against the Rams. Against the SB champs, just damn.

I hope we're not going all in this year. We couldn't outright win our own division with a losing record. We had 2 anomalous wins. Typically you aren't going to win scoring 13 and have your opponent have an absolute train wreck offense. Also, a team scoring 16 on 6 trips to the red zone is not normal either. I'm not trying to be a pessimist. We're not there. Bryce isn't there. Most of the year our offense legitimately struggled and the missing piece wasn't a TE. Keep building through the draft and reasonable FA. When we have a team that's on the edge of being able to make a legitimate SB run, then go all in. Otherwise, going all in right now feels like another Bryce situation. Sell out and pray. That's not how consistent winners are built.

I don't see it as drafting a premium player to sit and wait if Walker gets hurt. We need a legitimate swing T. Unless you have a Sewell or Slater type tackle that is pretty much a sure thing, these guys can need some time to develop year 1 just like a QB ideally should. They all haven't played the elite 5 star talent on the edge. If we think another franchise tackle has dropped to us at 19, you have to pull the trigger. The position is just too damn hard to find. If it's just a "we need a tackle and this guy has a T on the board", yeah, move on, take one in the later rounds. But if that guy is there, let him back up and learn a year, then slide him into LT on year 2 of his rookie deal. I don't see us being able to offer Walker a multi year contract after a prove it year, pay Moton his final almost fully guaranteed year, Hunt, Lewis a center and do a 50-60m extension for Bryce. The 3 most important positions on the field are QB, blindside tackle (usually LT), and edge rusher. Those are the premium positions that cost the most and are hardest to come by. If a starting caliber talent is there at 19 you have to pull the trigger. I understand the need for a DT and S. I've been on the C and FS train for years. If we weren't staring at a potential Bryce extension, it'd make the decision a lot easier I think. It's just with all these huge contracts I don't see how we can hedge our bets on being able or even wanting to re-sign Walker, especially if he has a bad year. Icky and BC's injuries really hurt our long term plans. If no blue chip talent at those 3 key positions are available at 19, by all means pass and draft another position. But I think it's pretty safe to say we don't have a guaranteed lock at any of them right now beyond Phillips, and they have to be somewhat of a priority.

If we could without breaking the bank in picks I would love to. He's been in Peyton's dog house for whatever reason. He's not a bad receiver from what I've seen in game, he just doesn't make the field a lot on game day.

Icky is no guarantee to ever return to football, plus his salary is already 100% guaranteed. He's on the books no matter what. BC is coming off an Achilles injury and played much better at guard than he ever did at tackle, not to mention, Achilles is usually a 2 year recovery to full performance level. BC would be on a very low cost prove it deal. He only made 2.8m last year anyway. You really want to put a tackle with a busted wheel, one coming off a major knee injury, or a guy that can't crack the Raiders roster on Bryce's blind side if Walker gets injured?

Right now our only depth at T was cut from the worst offensive line in the NFL and we have nothing for next year except 1 year left on Moton, who already admittedly has knee concerns, though he minimizes them, which I would too for over 40m bucks. You have to draft for the future as well as the present. Being short sighted is why we ended up paying 2 guards 150m instead of drafting them when they were sitting right in front of us to take. If we end up paying Bryce 50-60M per season, we're going to need some guys on rookie contracts.

Taking a 6'8" tackle with a 5'9" QB just seems like a bad idea

Now if we could only get a punt/kickoff return specialist. I've never forgotten the impact Devin Hester made as a returner. Every time he lined up, you had to wonder was he taking it to the house. Having a feared return guy is better than a WR6 that only sees the field during practice.

"I feel like I can work with anybody. I feel like winning is the ultimate goal and I — just like our team — have got to be willing to adjust and adapt to things that are going on." When one of the conditions is Bryce has to be your ride or die, you can't adjust and adapt. Bryce being the guy was a condition from the get go.

Maybe he is. Maybe he isn't. We just gave an extension to a QB that couldn't even significantly best Howell's only season as a starter. Our bar for QB is so low it's laying on the ground and everyone is tip toeing around it afraid to actually do anything to raise the standards even a little fugging bit.

All of this plus, even after you find your first, you still need to keep looking for the next, just not as aggressively. One injury changes everything, as we've just seen with Icky. We thought we were set and now we aren't. Just the nature of this sport.

Dalton is ancient by NFL standards. Howell is only 25. Howell's only year as a starter he put up almost 4k yards, 21/21 with a 43.2 QBR while being sacked 65 times. This past year and the 3rd starting, which many would consider to be Bryce's best, he barely put up 3k yards 23/11 with a QBR of 47.6 while being sacked 27 times. Pickett 4 years in the league, with 27 starts, he's amassed 4900 yards, 16/16 with a 53.6 QBR. Now if Bryce were injured for a season, which QB would you say has more potential to step in and run an offense? I'd say Howell only because in a single season he threw for 1k yards less, more tds and granted more ints in 11 less games as a starter than Pickett's whole career. Everyone is saying Pickett sucks, Howell sucks, but what I'm seeing is Bryce is right on par with them. Howell is on his 5th team, so is KP, yet Bryce just got a 5th year extension putting up pretty much similar numbers. The bar for QB on this organization is really low. Did I want Howell? I didn't care. I wanted someone, anyone, who can potentially be better than what we've had the past 3 years or who we signed as a backup. We do not have even a mid tier NFL QB on the roster right now. If Howell was brought in as camp fodder and didn't make the cut, wouldn't hurt my feelings at all. If we bring in another QB via the draft, I hope it's someone who could have the potential to be a starting QB with some development because that's the whole point. We can't be afraid to bring in anyone who might have the potential to unseat Bryce or take his job if he's injured. The goal is to get winning seasons and make SB runs with hopefully a victory or 2. Pickett doesn't accomplish that. Dalton hasn't been able to even be in consideration for that role in over 2 years.

You could just as easily turn that around. Imagine drafting a guy number 1 overall, because he surrounded by more talent than 95% of the opposition that he played in college, put him on a bad team facing opposition that is at least equal to or better than his offensive talent, and believing he is going to not only excel from day 1, but that he is going to be able to lead an offense at a top NFL level at playoff contender level. I don't think the expectations are too high. The top QB prospect should be able to at least have back to back games where he looks like a NFL QB. We haven't seen that in 3 years.

I genuinely do not care who is our QB as long as they are producing at a mid to upper starting NFL QB level. If we do not have that, we should be looking for it. I care about one thing, winning. And it's been 8 damn years and counting since we've had a winning season. For those saying we did some amazing fleece job by selling off Dalton for a 7th, we had to buy that god awful QB contract first to even be able to sell him off. And it's not like it was ever a good signing anyway, because Dalton had already proved his time as a viable backup was over the year before. For all the good things Dan has done this and last off season, the moves regarding the QB room make zero sense at all.