mountainpantherfan2

There's really two parts to this question. 1) What does Bryce have to do to prove that he was worthy of the 1st overall pick (and the Panthers trade up to acquire said pick) and be seen as the franchise QB/face of the organization for the foreseeable future? 2) What does Bryce have to do to be a serviceable starter past this season and allow the team to be in a position of not being desperate in their next try at acquiring a franchise QB? I don't think Bryce is capable of ever living up to the expectation of the 1st overall pick and being a franchise QB. His physical limitations will not allow him to ever be that QB. He could, however, show enough to be a placeholder. Not what you want out of this deal but it's better than him being released at the end of the season. Minimum of 6-8 wins with him showing he can lead the offense (scoring around 17-24 points per game on offense) and make plays when it matters especially as the end of the season nears. It will also show that Morgan is capable of assembling a competitive roster and Caneles is capable of installing a modern NFL offense. Then you wait and draft/sign/trade for a franchise QB when the situation is to your best advantage. This is how the Chiefs got Mahomes, the Eagles got Hurts, the Ravens got Jackson and the Packers got both Rodgers and Love. Or we luck into it like the Patriots did with Brady and the 49er's did with Purdy.

Wow, completely forgot about Matt Coral! Just think, we go with Coral and sign Dalton as backup. Trade Bruns to the Rams and keep DJ Moore. Maybe draft Gibbs at 9. Even if the season ended the same, we would have had the 1st overall pick and the 19th overall pick from Rams in this draft. Still had DJ Moore. And had two 1st round picks in 2025. God, Fitterer was an idiot!

I hated the trade up more so than draft pick last year. I just didn't see any of the options being that for sure #1 overall, franchise QB. I didn't even think they should draft a QB #9. I feel like the sweet spot to draft a QB is between picks 11-50. And don't do it when you are desperate for one. But you're right, it didn't seem like that then tried to build the team around Bryce's strengths. I would say they are doing better at that this year. And the scheme has helped other QB's in the past. Hoping for the best but not very hopeful.

That's a great analysis! So, with that analysis, how do you think Bryce had the game he had vs Green Bay. Was it that the Packer's defense was just giving him those ideal scenarios or was it an anomaly from Bryce?

@CRA actually, I said kidnap Mahomes. It was hyperbole. But if you want to take it literally, I'm still pretty sure Mahomes wouldn't have won any more games for us if the team broke into his home, covered his head with a bag, brought him to Charlotte and then tried to force him to play QB for us in 2023. Or maybe he does. Either way, I feel like the line was the bigger issue than the play at QB.

Just to clarify, Stroud had a very good season and did a lot of things the right way for a rookie. I wasn't trying to downgrade his accomplishments in 2023 at all. What I was trying to point out was that Stroud, again in my opinion, didn't showcase a skill set that resembled a player that could elevate over the struggles of the 2023 Panthers offense as a whole. QB's like Newton or Jackson or Mahomes (that last reference in my post was hyperbole) can and have elevated above their teams weaknesses. Stroud played good enough and made. those around him better enough to get them to the playoffs in a weak division. Of all the reasonable options that could have started for the Panthers at QB in 2023 (Young, Stroud, Richardson, Levis, and Dalton) none seemed to be the type of player that would have succeeded more than Young did with the offensive line and the entire offensive system being as bad as it was.

There are a lot of moving parts to this type of questions and way too many variables to consider to really predict how the outcome would have been any different in 2023 with Dalton starting more than just one game. But instead of focusing on that Seattle game, another game, and the game following it, are more intriguing to me. Week 16 vs Green Bay. Young had the best game of his rookie season. 23/36 (64%) for 312 with 2 TD and no INT. Thielen (6/94), Chark (6/98) and Tremble (4/59) all had huge plays in the passing game. The running game was a different story. Hubbard (16/43) and Sanders (3/3) combined for just 46 yards rushing. Mays was starting at LG and Jensen at RG. The offensive line was able to protect Young just enough to keep the Panthers in the game until the very end. But this wasn't because they were playing at a high level, rather the Packers defense played horrible this game. But this horrible defensive effort by the Packers allowed us to see what could be possible if Young had time to process and throw. Fast forward to Week 17 vs Jacksonville. The offense was shut out and the offensive line allowed 6 sacks and 8 more QH's. If you go back and watch these games back to back, the line play if very noticeable. When Young had time in process and move, he was spot on. When the line collapsed, like most QBs, he was ineffective. When you draft a QB 1st overall in the draft, especially if you trade up to do so, you hope to get a QB that can make plays despite the struggles around him. Think Newton his rookie year. Should the Panthers have traded up in the 2023 draft to the 1st overall and should they have drafted Young at that spot? My opinion is no to the first question and no QB in 2023 was worth trading up to take in the top 10. Neither Stroud, Richardson or Levis would have been worth it. But none of them would have fared any better than Young either with the Panthers, in my opinion. Stroud had a good season in Houston but he didn't have a Cam Newton or Lamar Jackson season. He needed slightly above average talent in one of the worst divisions to make the playoffs. He had the season we were hoping for in Carolina but wasn't going to get with Young or Stroud. Now, I'm not trying to put Young up on a pedestal here. There are a lot of questions that still surround him and his ability to be QB1 on the Panthers in the future. But the issue last year wasn't just the play at the QB position. And really, I don't think the WR issues were as much as people make them out to be. The real issue on this offense was the line and the running game. If your line can't get a push to run the ball or pass block to pass the ball, you have no offense. Start Young. Start Dalton. Draft Stroud, Richardson or Levis. Kidnap Mahomes. Doesn't matter, I think the end result would have been the same.

I have wondered the same thing. Seems possible that they had JPJ, Cooper and Brooks all rated about the same and then got the call from the Rams with the trade offer. They took it hoping that one of those 3 would be available at 52. Then JPJ got drafted at 44. Cooper at 45. So they traded back up to 46 to ensure they got one of the three they had pegged for 39. And I assume they just had Brooks rated higher than Frazier. At least that’s the way the board ended up looking to me.

I was a little surprised they didn’t draft any offensive linemen but I don’t see it as neglect. They signed 3 in FA. So it’s not like the unit hasn’t been addressed this offseason. We also signed 3 edge rushers in FA and then didn’t draft one even though it was a perceived need. One thing I forget at times with the draft is most teams have a budget either for positions or position groups that is a percentage of the salary cap. With Tilis coming in, I wonder how much influence he might have had on the direction of the draft from a financial perspective.

How bad would it be if both Cousins and Penix go on IR in the preseason? Both have a history with injuries. And with the way this all went down, it just feels like that would be the ultimate bad joke finish to the story. Not wishing anything on anyone, but Atlanta’s bad luck is on par with the Panthers. I could see it happening.

With the offense, the depth looks good except for the line. BC and Ninjam are good backups that can man multiple spots. But Mays and Zavala need some competition. Luckily, teams can routinely find quality backup lineman without having to spend big or trade. It's just a matter of letting them battle it out in camp. On defense, another depth spot at CB and Edge are needed. The fallout after the top 3 at both spots is pretty wide. Signing Gilmore takes care of one of those spots but not sure there will be anything left in the cap after doing so. Maybe Barno or Johnson might surprise us and show a lot of growth.

Wallace is a tackling machine. He has a lot of the same qualities as Morgan had to be honest. His biggest knock seems to be his ability to read and identify. If your expectation is that in year one he comes in and is that Luke style MLB that is the QB of the defense, then not he needs to develop to become that. However, if you pair him with Shaq and have Shaq call and lead the defense and ask him to go make the tackle, he will deliver.

I’ve seen three separate times already where the Panthers have been rated in the top 5 for this draft. Specifically focusing on our first 5 picks. Granted I’ve not been actively looking for these rankings so there may be some out there that have the panthers not rated as highly. As for me, I give the draft class a B but would give the total outcome an A with us picking up the 2nd for next year. Like many others I really thought we would address the center position early. That was the only negative.

I do think Clowney is better than Burns. Just as productive in rushing the passer but much better at defending the run. Joey is a down grade to Luvu though.

Xavien Howard, JC Jackson, Cameron Sutton and Patrick Peterson are all also still available. I would prefer Gilmore but there are still other option is the asking price is too high.