CPcavedweller

Adam Gase and Matt Rhule were his head coaches. Where would Patrick Mahomes be with those two?

All of the QB needy teams have more needs than QB, not enough cap space, and don't want to give up multiple first round picks.

Apparently around Week 1 the offer was around $180 mm guaranteed. He said no. It then dropped because he was injured again

Because he's said...what he wants?

According to Adam Schefter, they can't contact Lamar right now because it would be considered tampering. All of this is a non-issue. Teams saying "we aren't interested" is to protect them from any claims of tampering by the Ravens, ala the Dolphins in 2022. In other words, teams coming out and saying "we are not pursuing Lamar Jackson" (right now) is cover for not losing draft picks and being fined by the NFL. Had the NFL not taken draft picks from the Dolphins, this wouldn't have happened. So guess what? It's much ado about nothing. It's a cover until the tampering window is done. Why it's considered tampering, I don't know. I'm just repeating what Schefter said and ultimately answering the question of "is it collusion?" No, it isn't. But, my point stands. Not only do you have to offer Lamar a fully guaranteed contract, you then have to trade your 2023 and 2024 1st round draft pick away. This for a guy who is a bottom 12 passer by DVOA and has missed several games in each of the past three seasons. So, no, it's not collusion. It's not racism. You don't give a guy like Lamar guaranteed money to likely end up injured. Injury could strike anyone but with Watson, Lawrence, Brady, Wilson, etc. you have guys who throw first and are less likely to suffer an injury as a result. We've all witnessed this, as Panthers fans. Would you all have given Cam a $200,000,000 fully guaranteed contract in 2017? No. No. And no. Why? His playing style led to him being injured and it's a dumb thing to commit that much cap space, and draft picks, to a guy who may not be there. GM's and owners don't have to collude to reach this conclusion man.

Why would we take Hooker in the 2nd when we have Corral? If you don't take a QB in the 1st, you roll with Corral and re-sign Darnold. Why? If you draft a QB in the 2nd or later, they are probably going to be QB2, yet many would want a veteran to start. So then you end up with Veteran, Corral, Hooker. You're wasting a pick when there is a ton of talent in the first three rounds of this draft. 1. Torrance 2. Darnell Washington 3. Zach Charbonnet 4. Mimms 5. Re-sign Darnold and see if Caldwell can help develop Corral and Darnold enough to maybe have some trade bait in 2024 which you can then use to trade up to 1 or 2 to get Drake Maye or Caleb Williams. Doing this you've developed the talent base of your roster enough to have the ability to trade future 1sts away to nab one of those two QB's who will be generational talents like Trevor Lawrence and Andrew Luck.

It's collusion to not want to give a QB who has missed time in three of the last five seasons $250 million guaranteed? Ooohhhkkkayyy.

And that's the problem. "We are getting a QB one way or another" should not be the line of thinking. "Spare no expense" only works in Jurassic Park and MLB, and it doesn't always work well in either; ask Dr. Malcolm about his leg and the Yankees about all of their World Series championships the past 18 years or so. If there is a transcendent talent like a Trevor Lawrence, Drake Maye, Caleb Williams, Peyton Manning, Andrew Luck, etc. it's a no brainer. If it's not one of those "can't miss" guys, you are throwing darts at a dart board while blind folded but the stakes are almost as bad as if someone is standing on either side of the dart board, unable to move. You may hit them in the arm and they will be fine, but you missed. Or you may hit them in the eye and they will be screwed for life. The only certain player in this draft, in my opinion, is CJ Stroud. Everyone else is a gamble. If you have to gamble with multiple first round picks, you don't do it. You just don't. You roll with what you have, stack talent and trade picks and develop the roster around the QB. Then in 2024 you go for guys like Maye and Williams.

It's a mess because we are about to trade even more assets away for someone who may or may not be worthwhile. Add to that we may be trying to trade with a Conference foe who already has a QB and we could just be mortgaging our future to look up at them. We have a solid QB and can't add talent around them. That's the trade-off and why I'd rather trade down, stack talent, and work on getting enough picks to take Maye or Williams next year. You can stack, stack, stack talent on days 1 and 2 in this draft but we are going to avoid doing that to take a guy like Will Levis. I'd be good with Anthony Richardson, though not trading up much to get him, or Stroud. The recent history on teams who have traded up for QB's isn't pretty, at all. None of them since 2015 are on the team that drafted them.

He has missed several games the last three seasons. If you could get full years out of him, every year, like a Peyton, Tom, Joe, Patrick, etc. then yeah, you pay him. If not, you don't give him guaranteed money that he's asking for. Guaranteed money is for guaranteed play and he hasn't been able to do that.

Well, that's a good deal for the Saints. His style of ball translates to longevity and if he is a Matthew Stafford type who just needed out of the black hole known as the Raiders organization, the Saints will be set.

These are the next two NFL Stars. Absent something unexpected happening with the 2023 class, I don't see anyone but Stroud having the potential of these two. This isn't going to be popular, but how about we don't trade away future 1st's for a guy like Will Levis who has "BUST POTENTIAL" written on his forehead and instead...trade downnnnn. Build the roster with the depth and breadth of talent available at skill positions and the offensive line, compile picks, and get enough to have a package ready to go for 2024. That is assuming others aren't already plotting to suck as well. The Jaguars lucked into sucking bad enough to get Lawrence. The Colts planned to suck to get Luck. The Panthers probably started TEH JIMMEHH (those who don't get this obviously weren't around) to get to the top of the 2011 draft, thinking Luck would be there. Tons of examples of this happening where it completely changed the outlook of a franchise. Now FLAME ME. That is unless you don't watch college football and haven't seen Caleb Williams or Drake Maye. They have transcendent potential.

Aww yeah. Let's take a guy with a good head on his shoulders because he's from Greensboro. Dude had one good season in an Air Raid system. He can throw go routes to wide open receivers. Great! SIGN ME UP. Or, we already have Corral who is basically the same guy so why waste a pick at all?

Trading two 1st round picks, a 3rd, and a 4th for Will Levis... Can YOU IMAGINE the meltdown this place would have. Good god man please let it happen. That would be the worst.

Well, here is a pro tip, don't trade up for Richardson. You either take him at 9 or trade down, collect more picks, re-sign Darnold/Gorropolo, get a star TE, a star RB, and a third wide receiver, as well as the best offensive lineman in the draft in O'Cyrus Torrance. I have this poo all planned out in my head. How we get star players in our first three picks. 1. Torrance 2. Kincaid/Mayer/Darnell Washington 3. Charbonnet 4. Mimms Boom. All of those guys have All-Pro potential. We sign them, put them on IR for sprained ankles (all of them), then we SUCKKKKKK for Drake Maye. I'm talking going -1 - 18. Drake Maye/Caleb Williams will be the next two stars in this league. You can book that today, tomorrow, and twice on Wednesday.

How many other people are interested in Stroud? And are the Bears willing to trade down to 9? We would probably have to trade up to 3, then trade up to 1. By that point Stroud better be as good as Mahomes or we, and he, are screwed.

Carr is a 4 time Pro Bowler in 9 seasons. He was Top 10 with Jon Gruden. Then McDaniel's comes in and does what he did in Denver with Jay Cutler, absolutely nothing. So was Derek Carr the issue in Vegas or was it McDaniel's? Time will tell but I have a feeling that the Belicheck (sp?) only works if you're Bill. His primary assistants fail outside of New England because Bill is a much, much better NFL coach than any one is willing to give him credit for, despite SEVEN SUPER BOWL RINGS. He and Tom and symbiotic. It wasn't one or the other, it was both. Then you add Bill, Josh, and Matt and you have another symbiotic relationship. They all three work well together but take one away and what do you get? I wouldn't be selling Carr short here, especially with the offense that they run and the receivers that they have. He is probably better than Brees was in the last three years of his career and that will present an issue for us.

Wait, so lower demand equals a higher price? That is not how supply-demand work at all. The less suitors, the less expensive it becomes to trade up, period. They aren't going to hold onto it out of spite.

Because Lamar hasn't finished the season in 3 of the last 5 years. So if his "prime" is being injured, I'd hate to see what the 2nd half of his career looks like. Who is paying a QB $250,000,000, guaranteed, to ride a bike? Can you imagine? Just imagine. They have literally NO incentive to either want to play or work to restructure their deal. You won't be able to offload their contract because no one else will trade for that. And he plays a style of ball that will not translate well at all to aging. He is like a bottom 10 passer in the league as backed up by advanced statistics and is oft injured. Good luck Lamar. It's not racist to not want to give you the Brinks truck because while effective when on the field, you have to be on the field to be worth the cash. I see his injury issues stacking up rather than magically disappearing.

Except that Carr is signing with the Saints and Stroud will probably be number 1, or should be. It shouldn't even be close really. I really think Levis is going to end up being a Jake Locker type. What really worries me is that this draft ends up being similar to 2011 where there was Cam Newton and a cliff. I think you take Darnold for cheap and draft Richardson. Darnold showed that he is a good teammate and can be a leader last season. If he wants to start again after 2023, you can let him go. If he's willing to accept a back-up spot, you bring him back. Most quality teams have long-term back-up QB's who help the starter. Their purview is completely different.

It can't be any worse here, right?!?!? I envision that we actually got the 3rd Reich before the 2nd. Rhule obviously being the 3rd and Rivera being the 1st, with possibly the royalty period prior to the upheaval of pretty much all of Europe in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. Rivera was a dude who meant well but just couldn't execute. Rhule acted as if he was god's gift to football (He who must not be named) and I'd like to thing of Reich as a stronger version of the leaders of the Weimar Republic; though their ultimate downfall was financial in nature. People will do ridiculous poo when they are scared and out of money.

Stroud was still really good in those games that they lost. Anyone doubting him after the UGA game is a clown.

What do we give up in the future though? If we aren't a perennial playoff team by trading up to one then you just screwed yourself big time, no matter how good your QB is.

Ym, no. We don't agree that trading up is right at all. I think you go where you need to in order to get Stroud or Richardson.

My point stands, sign Darnold for cheap and draft Richardson. Maybe Darnold can become our new Derek Anderson.